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AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

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Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#41

Post by dustingetz »

rdtsc wrote: post #4
zmblum wrote: post #2

What about the following paragraph is not clear? "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and Warrants shall not be issued, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Am I missing something? Of cour…

That is written for you to learn in 5th grade civics class and feel good about your country and your government. But is not for those printing & spending hundreds of billions of dollars.

well, no, that was written by government leaders attempting to protect civil liberties from future government leaders. It just didn't work.

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#42

Post by tesseract »

rdtsc wrote: post #4
zmblum wrote: post #2

What about the following paragraph is not clear? "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and Warrants shall not be issued, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Am I missing something? Of cour…

That is written for you to learn in 5th grade civics class and feel good about your country and your government. But is not for those printing & spending hundreds of billions of dollars.

Oh? I thought it was written by a bunch of guys (these days we'd probably call them "insurgents" or somesuch) who had recently been fed up with a government that was unreasonably searching them, etc., and didn't want it to happen again.

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#43

Post by tesseract »

rst wrote: post #14
zmblum wrote: post #2

What about the following paragraph is not clear? "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and Warrants shall not be issued, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Am I missing something? Of cour…

It doesn't say a thing about "electronic communications". Which gives prosecutors, the FBI, and the national security state a large opportunity to blow smoke.

Difficulty of amending the US constitution is a double edged sword.

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#44

Post by pedalpete »

fingerprinter wrote: post #21

One thing I see people saying on here is that people should care....and I do...but I don't know _what_ to do with it! Can someone show/tell me what I, an average person, can do? It feels a bit overwhelming and things like this point out how powerless we really are. I hope I'm wrong and there are things we can do...I just don't know what they are. EDIT - Asking two more specific questions: 1. What can we do technicall…

Yes to Petition your government, contact your congressperson, and support the EFF.

The problem with making yourself 'technically safe' is that it realistically leaves most non-technical people exposed.

The only way to 'protect' everybody is to cure the cancer, not just your symptoms.

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#45

Post by daniel1980fl »

I remember reading that long time ago. It actually made me quit AT&T and every time someone called me, I tend to ask or check their number and tell them you calling me from AT&T do you know about "the room"? Couple times my friends quit it for the same reason; others don't care. I guess the answer is switch to a different career.

I had a good laugh when I read (think it was Wikipedia) about that room. AT&T was sued over it... they defends themselves by 1) the room does not exist AND 2) this lawsuit should not be proceed due to Act of National Security setting aside lawsuit frames. LOOL! I dont know about you -- but to me first contradicts the second one :)) the judge only decided on count 2) -- that it is indeed NSA involved - so it was dismissed, but if there is NSA then the room exists, hahahaha!!

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#46

Post by holdenc »

drivebyacct2 wrote: post #3

This is literally years-old information. I was aware of and hollering about this at people as a highschooler at debate and speech tournaments. Same thing then as now, no one cares, or those that do care don't care enough. Besides, who cares if you have nothing to hide. Right?

In principal it's quite wrong and scary, but in reality I have to believe the government is too incompetent to actually do anything with their mountains of AT&T collected data.

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#47

Post by nopassrecover »

SoftwareMaven wrote: post #18
drivebyacct2 wrote: post #3

This is literally years-old information. I was aware of and hollering about this at people as a highschooler at debate and speech tournaments. Same thing then as now, no one cares, or those that do care don't care enough. Besides, who cares if you have nothing to hide. Right?

My father-in-law said exactly that to me. I wanted to reach out and smack him. Unfortunately, it isn't just a "mental copout", either. He is a very intelligent person who has arrived at a conclusion that the government oversight is OK because he has nothing to hide and (I have inferred) he is very afraid of those who do have something to hide.

I bet your father-in-law wouldn't take too kindly to Government workers taking a look at his wife naked when they felt like it or recording (if you'll forgive me) their ahem marital moments.

Privacy is a human requirement, as evidenced by the deprivation of privacy as a punishment in prisons, and is much more than protection of those with something to hide.

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#48

Post by naner »

wtn wrote: post #33
fingerprinter wrote: post #21

One thing I see people saying on here is that people should care....and I do...but I don't know _what_ to do with it! Can someone show/tell me what I, an average person, can do? It feels a bit overwhelming and things like this point out how powerless we really are. I hope I'm wrong and there are things we can do...I just don't know what they are. EDIT - Asking two more specific questions: 1. What can we do technicall…

Besides using SSH and VPN more, the only thing I can do is avoid ATT. I was on T-Mobile for years (out of ATT spite) until Verizon got the iPhone and I jumped within the week. I also spent a lot more money on internet using alternatives to ATT DSL (although I doubt my information was more secure from that choice).

Considering other ISPs peer with AT&T this is really everyone's problem.

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#49

Post by jedsmith »

holdenc wrote: post #46
drivebyacct2 wrote: post #3

This is literally years-old information. I was aware of and hollering about this at people as a highschooler at debate and speech tournaments. Same thing then as now, no one cares, or those that do care don't care enough. Besides, who cares if you have nothing to hide. Right?

In principal it's quite wrong and scary, but in reality I have to believe the government is too incompetent to actually do anything with their mountains of AT&T collected data.

According to paperwork leaked by Mark Klein, they have/had a "Narus STA 6400" in the room. It's described as a supercomputer that sounds, to my ears, similar to Carnivore. I doubt that they even try to collect (too much data), and instead specifically look for things to grab from the firehose.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narus

http://narus.com/index.php/solutions/intercept

Re: AT&T has a fiberoptic splitter copying our data to NSA

#50

Post by ceejayoz »

Joakal wrote: post #26
thematt wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, yes...all those minus Sweden. The US, UK, Canada, Australia and New Zealand all cooperate together. See the Ecehlon program: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Echelon_%28signals_intelligence...

Oddly enough, I hear rumours that it's a spy program on businesses, not people.

Spying on businesses generally involves spying on their people.
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