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Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

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Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#331

Post by draw_down »

asdfman123 wrote: post #249
kemiller2002 wrote: post #3

This is sound advice. You have a significant amount of control over people's lives as a manager, and that should be treated with a level of respect. You have no idea how people feel, and it is quite possible that someone you manage doesn't know where they stand with you. At times that is more than enough to cause them stress and even convince them to look elsewhere. Work is stressful enough, and you don't need to add…

I've discovered when there's a power dynamic going on between two people, it's usually not a very good idea to pretend like that doesn't exist -- despite the fact that it is my natural inclination to joke about it and downplay it. Instead, I find it's better to be kind, take things seriously and treat people with respect. Yes, the power dynamic exists. Yes, I believe it's somewhat unfair and I wish society wasn't str…

That's what I was going to say. This power differential exists, me and my manager are not friends, he has more power over my life than pretty much anyone. I don't think it's appropriate to pretend like this isn't true.

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#333

Post by P-ala-din »

xapata wrote: post #314
P-ala-din wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

so which one is wrong?

"Not all foo are bar." "This foo is bar." Both statements can be true simultaneously.

Of course, that's true but I can't map that to the statements at hand.

I understood it to be:

P(W) == P(M)

and P(W) > P(M)

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#334

Post by Grimm1 »

throwanem wrote: post #305
Grimm1 wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or you know, have a meeting where your manager directly discusses the issue with you like an adult.

Yeah, exactly. It's pretty wild to see "transparency" invoked in the context of literally talking behind someone's back.

Yeah I did a double take there. I personally believe that someone with that management methodology is entirely unfit for their position.

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#335

Post by bradjohnson »

P-ala-din wrote: post #216
throwaway3563 wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome "... five subgroups this syndrome often falls into. - The perfectionist - The superwoman/man - The natural genius - The soloist - The expert"

"While early research focused on the prevalence among high-achieving women, impostor syndrome has been recognized to affect both men and women equally." "The researchers concluded that the women who participated in this study experienced impostor phenomenon more so than the men who participated." am I misparsing this sentence? how can both be true?

I may be wrong because it is worded unclearly, but I think the first is referring to the magnitude by which men and women are affected, i.e. those that are affected, be they men or women, experience the same impact to their self esteem/worth. The second is referring to the fact that women are more frequently affected by it.

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#336

Post by notJim »

cmonnow wrote: post #276
CapriciousCptl wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of life is tactfully dealing with people who have power over you. It’s not very comfortable for anyone.

Wisdom is realizing no one really has power over you. You are voluntarily & temporarily handing over that power to someone else in exchange for money. The moment you renounce your desire for money from that company, you get back that power you handed over. And that was, is, and will, always be your decision. Thus, the power never left your hands.

> You are voluntarily & temporarily handing over that power to someone else in exchange for money.

The thing you're missing is that money is required to live. If I "voluntarily" decide to stop earning it, or if I end up in a job where I earn substantially less, a state employee with a gun will eventually show up to my house and evict me from it. If I am hungry and take some food from a store, a state employee with a gun will put me in a cage. The idea that there's no power dynamic at play here is absurd.

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#337

Post by hu3 »

dfxm12 wrote: post #156

Another thing: don't compare people in your team to recently let-go people. As a survivor after a series of lay-offs, I took over a project from someone who was recently laid off (let's call him Joe), got asked a really vague question about it and responded, IMO reasonably, that clarification was needed. All I got back was "That's a Joe -type of answer" (emphasis theirs). I don't think it was funny, and it certainly…

You're not alone. I'd be quite unconformable to hear that. Sorry that you have to experience such awkward conversation and be called "too snippy" after complaining about it on top of that.

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#338

Post by notJim »

CapriciousCptl wrote: post #256
zeroxfe wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This disregards the power imbalance -- lots of employees (especially junior ones) are not comfortable being so firm with their managers.

Part of life is tactfully dealing with people who have power over you. It’s not very comfortable for anyone.

Turning this into an issue of mere comfort betrays a great deal of privilege. Many, arguably most, people are a firing or two away from poverty and misery. In tech, this can be especially true of people early in their careers, and especially those from less-advantaged backgrounds. If you get fired from your first tech job, and your manager talks a bunch of shit about you, that may be your last tech job.

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#339

Post by vkou »

User23 wrote: post #209
tinyhouse wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My wife and I decided, before we got married, that divorce was off the table for us. Well, you can decide whatever you want before you get married. People change, things happen, it's called life...

Catholics believe that marriage ends only with death. While obviously a civil divorce is possible, the actual sacramental marriage is indissoluble. One of the consequences of this belief is that Catholic couples are considerably less likely to get a civil divorce than other Christians or atheists[1]. [1] https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/catholics-continue-t...

Except that Catholics also practice annulment, which is, for all intents and purposes, a divorce (That you carry out through the church, as opposed to secular courts.)

Instead of breaking up a marriage, they claim, post-facto, that it was not a 'true[1] marriage', and is, therefore, invalid in the eyes of God and men.

This is a loophole big enough to drive a bus through, and is practiced quite frequently.

[1] The technical term is sacramented.

Re: Advice to new managers: don't joke about firing people

#340

Post by amznthrowaway5 »

alexandercrohde wrote: post #88

I think a good parallel would be how would you feel as a manager if your employee jokes about quitting to go get more money somewhere else?

That's not a good parallel at all, the manager still has the real power and can fire/PIP the employee for making that joke.
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