After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered • Hacker News Board

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#71

Post by fsloth » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:50 PM UTC

JackFr wrote: post #24

nix23 wrote: post #8

Its terrible how the American system thinks about prison's. Imagine he could do/learn something good in those 10 years, when he was locked away to protect the public (and that really should be the only point for prisons (protect the public))

> and that really should be the only point for prisons (protect the public) That's not true. Our prisons should protect the public, rehabilitate prisoners in so far as they can, and, to an appropriate extent, punish. Some people are skittish about the idea of punsihment. But it's abhorrent to our sense of justice that one suffer no consequences after committing a crime. Now in general I think our prisons and sentenci…

It's very interesting people would want prisons to punish people.

It is known that justice systems are fallible.

To demand explicit punishment as part of prison service is equivalent of saying "It's ok if lot of innocent people are punished as long as it is made sure all guilty are punished as well".

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#72

Post by qayxc » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:51 PM UTC

buboard wrote: post #51

The story seems off (temporally) for someone who got incarcerated circa 2010. Nothing very interesting has happened to technology since then.

That's only because you were there while the chances happened. You also didn't lose a good portion of your cognitive abilities due to spending 13 months in complete isolation.

It's basically impossible to imagine skipping a decade and noticing the changes. Same way you cannot detect yourself or close friends and family ageing from day to day.

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#73

Post by Frost1x » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:51 PM UTC

minikites wrote: post #44

JackFr wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and that really should be the only point for prisons (protect the public) That's not true. Our prisons should protect the public, rehabilitate prisoners in so far as they can, and, to an appropriate extent, punish. Some people are skittish about the idea of punsihment. But it's abhorrent to our sense of justice that one suffer no consequences after committing a crime. Now in general I think our prisons and sentenci…

>to an appropriate extent, punish. What's the overall goal of punishment? We know it's not a deterrent to crime. We know it doesn't help recidivism rates. The only remaining reason I can think of is spite/hate.

From my perspective, I've found that many against promoting rehabilitation (at least for less heinous crimes) tend to see prison as a day at the park.

Essentially, they're trapped in a prison in the form of low income or poverty where significant portions of their time must be spent working. They don't understand how a prisoner could potentially or at least perceptually be better off than them: consistent housing provided, guaranteed food, medical treatment, time for education and growth. When you have such gaps with economic inequality in a society where for those on the lower end of the spectrum combined with some misconception of prison life, prison can actually seem better, you have many who tend to promote punishment over rehabilitation.

"Someone did something society deemed as negative and they're rewarded, I did what society said was positive and seem to be punished relative to those acted negatively. I struggle to survive and work constantly while this person leisures (albeit with limited freedom) and studies."

So as you coined it, probably spite.

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#74

Post by izzydata » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:51 PM UTC

ptsneves wrote: post #40

A bit ironic given that you are writing a comment in a social media website, hacker news. :)

https://thenib.com/mister-gotcha/

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#75

Post by piva00 » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:53 PM UTC

gdy wrote: post #34

Arubis wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some people are skittish about the idea of punsihment. But it's abhorrent to our sense of justice that one suffer no consequences after committing a crime. I suspect this is the majority view, but it’s not universal. I’m pointing this out not to argue with you directly so much as to point out that this may be more _your_ sense of justice than a general rule of human nature.

Just wait until someone you love gets murdered or maimed.

Emotional responses shouldn't trump your sense of justice and fairness to human life. I have someone that was close to me murdered and I don't think that a harsher punishment only for my enjoyment is the answer to "what is justice?".

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#76

Post by solarengineer » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:53 PM UTC

We’ve often had to relearn or learn. That’s what the author needs to do as well. When faced with a totally new system, they’d have poked about and grokked it.

Come to think of it, they have a massive advantage over many of us - the absence of a distracted mind, the absence of short attention spans.

If they applied themselves to it, they can learn new stuff again.

Per society norms and laws, they did the crime and paid the time. I wish them all the best with a fresh start.

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#77

Post by kjakm » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:54 PM UTC

crazypython wrote: post #36

save_ferris wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my observations of the American public, people generally seem to be fine with the extreme sentences and punishment that the system doles out. We’re completely apathetic towards most criminals (usually unless they happen to be rich & white), without understanding the circumstances that created their situation. Take the Crystal Mason case. She’s a Texas woman of color who voted illegally in the 2016 election and got…

> Now, not knowing what you’re doing is a crime isn’t a legally sound defense argument, but it does raise serious questions about how we view punishment and those we deem should be punished. Isn't it a Mens Rea defense?

Mens rea is more intention to do the act, not knowledge of criminality. For example intentionally killing someone is murder even if you didn't know murder is a crime (because the act or killing was intended). The mens rea is intention to kill (if you lack the mens rea you end up with manslaughter or something equivalent).

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#78

Post by 9nGQluzmnq3M » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:55 PM UTC

annoyingnoob wrote: post #56

I recently had someone in a restroom ask me how to flush the toilet. The toilets had IR sensors and flushed automatically. This person had been in prison for many years and had never seen that before. I think part of the social reform that people are protesting for recently needs to extend to people in prison. Our system does nothing to rehabilitate people or to prepare them to re-enter society. We need to treat pris…

FWIW, the rest of the world considers prison sentences in the US to be absurdly long. This guy apparently got 10 years for hacking; in much of Europe, you'd get less than that for murder.

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#79

Post by jimbokun » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:56 PM UTC

annoyingnoob wrote: post #56

I recently had someone in a restroom ask me how to flush the toilet. The toilets had IR sensors and flushed automatically. This person had been in prison for many years and had never seen that before. I think part of the social reform that people are protesting for recently needs to extend to people in prison. Our system does nothing to rehabilitate people or to prepare them to re-enter society. We need to treat pris…

Nowhere in the article does he ask for empathy, just describes what he is experiencing.

Re: After 10 years in tech isolation, I’m now outsider to things I once had mastered

#80

Post by JackFr » Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:56 PM UTC

Arubis wrote: post #30

JackFr wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and that really should be the only point for prisons (protect the public) That's not true. Our prisons should protect the public, rehabilitate prisoners in so far as they can, and, to an appropriate extent, punish. Some people are skittish about the idea of punsihment. But it's abhorrent to our sense of justice that one suffer no consequences after committing a crime. Now in general I think our prisons and sentenci…

> Some people are skittish about the idea of punsihment. But it's abhorrent to our sense of justice that one suffer no consequences after committing a crime. I suspect this is the majority view, but it’s not universal. I’m pointing this out not to argue with you directly so much as to point out that this may be more _your_ sense of justice than a general rule of human nature.

> more _your_ sense of justice than a general rule of human nature.

It's interesting -- I'm a very forgiving person. And I truly believe that hate consumes and destroys the hater not the hated. But something I believe we all should do individually, that is forgive, is not something I believe we should do collectively. Maybe it's irrational, maybe it's that doing it collectively requires some to forgive, quite possibly against their will.