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Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

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Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#111

Post by kwillets »

What I did most recently was to start out as a contractor and get a feel for the place. I found a good fit with some other skills (started out as a Vertica admin and got drafted to do some C++/SIMD work, and some stats, and now DW design/dev).

In the end I looked for the same things you would at a startup: growth, revenue, and technical fit, and found a good opportunity within a huge multinational. I've since filed a couple of (provisional) patents, and we're growing like crazy, so our exec got promoted.

We still have a lot of issues like others describe here with Conway's law, inter-group coordination, and so on, but we have clear goals and metrics.

In contrast, I had a previous job at Microsoft that completely stagnated, even as the rest of the company was booming. It really depends on the opportunity.

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#112

Post by j4yav »

austincheney wrote: post #5

Here is what it means to work at a big company: * Things work slowly, so relax. There are many people that have a hand in every aspect of a product decision. * At a startup you are actively changing the world. That’s done now. Put that completely out of your head. You are cog in a machine. Instead focus on your assigned product, help your teammates, and just learn to relax. * You, the individual, are not important. T…

Well that all sounds terribly depressing.

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#113

Post by woeirua »

KKKKkkkk1 wrote: post #38
austincheney wrote: post #5

Here is what it means to work at a big company: * Things work slowly, so relax. There are many people that have a hand in every aspect of a product decision. * At a startup you are actively changing the world. That’s done now. Put that completely out of your head. You are cog in a machine. Instead focus on your assigned product, help your teammates, and just learn to relax. * You, the individual, are not important. T…

> At a startup you are actively changing the world. That sounds very exciting. Can you point to one startup that's changing the world?

There are legit startups out there that do change the world. Most of them are not companies that you've ever heard of.

I think that companies that change the world satisfy the following criteria: 1 - their work is very hard to replicate. Not impossible, but it would take a competitor a long time to reproduce their product or service. 2 - people would notice a tangible impact on their life if the company disappeared tomorrow.

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#114

Post by toast0 »

maybeiambatman wrote: post #107
jerrysievert wrote: post #66

here are some things I've learned: * politics: yes, they exist everywhere, but tend to be amplified at larger companies. polish your political skills, and one thing that I've learned is that it's important to "show, don't tell" * fiefdoms: there are more of them, some more welcoming than others. be prepared for those that value power above all. you can't take it personally, or you'll go into a very dark place; "be th…

> polish your political skill Genuinely curious to know what this means.

Big companies can end up driven by incentives that are at best orthagonal to basic economics which means you often can't convince people to do things that make sense because they make sense.

If individuals are judged based on results against goals declared at the start of the period, they will tend not to do anything other than that. You can't say "the users want this", or "this will save $5 trillion dollars", or "we can't do our job without this" because those things don't matter to individuals. Instead, you have to argue for it to be put on a roadmap, or convince your management to convince their management to push them to do it sooner than 18 months from now. And you have to do it with a light touch, or there will be resentment.

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#115

Post by woeirua »

laktak wrote: post #27

If you end up in a 'bad' company you may make these experiences: - there are feuds between companies or even departments in the same org - decisions are not based on facts but on political circumstances - the outcome of an analysis is often predetermined - not the best idea/project/etc. win's but the one with the best connections - decisions are made that are damaging to the company just to deny someone else in the o…

This can be true at companies of any size. Sadly.

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#116

Post by jerrysievert »

maybeiambatman wrote: post #107
jerrysievert wrote: post #66

here are some things I've learned: * politics: yes, they exist everywhere, but tend to be amplified at larger companies. polish your political skills, and one thing that I've learned is that it's important to "show, don't tell" * fiefdoms: there are more of them, some more welcoming than others. be prepared for those that value power above all. you can't take it personally, or you'll go into a very dark place; "be th…

> polish your political skill Genuinely curious to know what this means.

let me provide an example of where more polished political skills might come in handy:

scenario 1, small startup - you're used to working very closely with a small team, know each others skills, strengths, and weaknesses, and can instantly drop in and say, "hey! it looks you're doing in a way that can be optimized, I'm doing the same thing, let's work together and do it right" without ruffling any feathers or destroying relationships.

scenario 2: big company, larger team, lots of cross-team work, same issue. "hi, I noticed that we're trying to work on the same thing and attempting to improve performance in similar manners. I'd hate to have us both duplicate this effort, do you have time to maybe bounce ideas off of each other so we can come to a better solution?" and knowing when to drop it when the answer is "no".

it's a difference in communication styles, which might be more difficult to adapt to when coming from a smaller organization.

does that help?

(note that I could also have said, "well, duh, just learn to communicate better!" but that would have been counter-productive in this case :) )

editing to add that I gave an example for one type of communication, sibling comments to this did a fantastic job of providing probably better examples.

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#117

Post by ethbro »

awinder wrote: post #97
bentcorner wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on where you go. I work at a BigCo and IMO if you see a "because that's the way it is" and you don't like it, you can change it if you can justify the change. Everything has tradeoffs and sometimes the cost to change something is higher than the benefits gained, but the people I work with are always willing to listen.

Yeah, same experience. You can't change all of the things but you can change like 1 thing at a time that's really peeving you off, iff you have a good reason & can make a good argument & it's worth your time & effort.

Change at startups means convincing 0-1 people. Change at a BigCo means convincing 5-10 people.

Those require very different tactics and skillsets.

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#119

Post by ethbro »

mcculley wrote: post #99
lunias wrote: post #72

Remember when you used to ask your Mom / Dad, "Why?" and they'd respond with, "Because I said so." It's like that, but subtly more infuriating because it's never a single identifiable person saying "no" that could be spoken to, understood, and reasoned with. The answer that you'll get at a big company is, "because that's the way it is".

That's well put. I did some contracting work for a very large organization last year. It was my first experience trying to navigate the rules inside such a large organization. The interaction that I found most amusing is that I would ask for something that would require crossing an organization boundary and the immediate response would be, "No.", followed shortly by, "Wait, why do you need that?" This happened severa…

That's a constant.

As an external consultant, do remember you have the power to play the expert.

"Well that's how other Top50 companies I've worked with have done it" isn't the worst card to play.

Usually though, it requires hitching your wagon to whatever VP brought you in, and trying not to burn them with blowback.

Although honestly, most of the time I think it was "No" on the basis of inertia / resistance to change, more than actual disagreement. So technical arguments can win the day there (with other engineers).

Re: Ask HN: Moving from a startup to a big co, what should I be aware of?

#120

Post by mceachen »

maybeiambatman wrote: post #107
jerrysievert wrote: post #66

here are some things I've learned: * politics: yes, they exist everywhere, but tend to be amplified at larger companies. polish your political skills, and one thing that I've learned is that it's important to "show, don't tell" * fiefdoms: there are more of them, some more welcoming than others. be prepared for those that value power above all. you can't take it personally, or you'll go into a very dark place; "be th…

> polish your political skill Genuinely curious to know what this means.

In a startup you may be only needing to convince yourself, or, maybe, a co-founder. Comms are mostly 1-1.

In a larger company you'll need to persuade a set of people to greenlight your project, or convince your executive chain that your team is providing value, or convince other teams that they should support (or at least not actively hinder) your project or team.

Politics can be toxic, but with the most rose-colored glasses, it can just be the practice of working effectively in a larger community.

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