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Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

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Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#91

Post by Stratoscope »

twblalock wrote: post #88
jedberg wrote: post #37

You know you're cool when you need a lawyer to change jobs. I think it would be reasonable to allow non-competes, however, the company should have to keep paying you your full compensation (salary, stock, bonuses, etc) for as long as they keep you from being employed. Sure, give the old employer veto power for a new job as long as they keep paying them for the lockout period.

The tech industry in California does just fine without noncompetes. In fact, lack of noncompetes is probably one of the biggest reasons Silicon Valley was able to take off in the 1950s-60s when people were constantly leaving their jobs to start new chip companies, starting with the original "traitorous 8" who founded Fairchild Semiconductor. There just aren't good arguments for noncompetes. People often bring up trad…

> In fact, noncompetes are probably one of the biggest reasons Silicon Valley was able to take off...

Just noting a typo for anyone confused by the wording, I'm sure you meant "the unenforceability of noncompetes is..." or something along those lines.

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#92

Post by twblalock »

Stratoscope wrote: post #91
twblalock wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tech industry in California does just fine without noncompetes. In fact, lack of noncompetes is probably one of the biggest reasons Silicon Valley was able to take off in the 1950s-60s when people were constantly leaving their jobs to start new chip companies, starting with the original "traitorous 8" who founded Fairchild Semiconductor. There just aren't good arguments for noncompetes. People often bring up trad…

> In fact, noncompetes are probably one of the biggest reasons Silicon Valley was able to take off... Just noting a typo for anyone confused by the wording, I'm sure you meant "the unenforceability of noncompetes is..." or something along those lines.

Thanks, fixed it.

Fun fact: noncompete agreements have been void in California since the 1800s.

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#93

Post by tuna-piano »

bcantrill wrote: post #65

Ugh, this garbage again. AWS came after someone I had hired trying to enforce the same non-compete, under more or less the same circumstances (Washington-based employee, working remote out of California). In the process I learned a bunch about this non-compete, and in particular about Amazon's behavior with respect to it: as of 2012, they had tried to enforce this non-compete "hundreds" of times -- and to the knowled…

It's quite an interesting strategy and for all Amazon's "long-termism", it's a strategy that seems quite short-term focused.

It may make their current employees decide not to leave, but it may also lower morale and make future recruits not join.

Talk to decision makers deciding which database to buy and see their thoughts about Oracle. Many have been around for decades and have worked for or with the company and refuse to buy their products. This feels like a great way to cement your company as a new Oracle.

Your short-sighted mean-spirited moves helped inspire your most dangerous competitor[1].

From Jack Welch - "I have a phrase: love them on the way out — I teach this to my school — love ’em on the way out the way you love them on the way in. And I’ll tell you another one: a severance dollar is the cheapest dollar you’ll ever spend. Those two things, if you practice that religiously, you’ll stay out of trouble, you’ll be perceived as fair. Maybe not loved, initially, but people will come to respect you. That’s why I have an army of friends. Many people who I let go are some of my closest friends."

[1]https://observer.com/2019/07/walmart-ecommerce-strategy-amaz...

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#94

Post by cwp »

JoshTko wrote: post #59

It's ironic seeing so many people in this thread being against non-competes, yet seeing so few people for unionizing in other HN threads.

Both non-competes and unions prevent competition in the labour market. Being against both is completely reasonable.

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#96

Post by franczesko »

bcantrill wrote: post #65

Ugh, this garbage again. AWS came after someone I had hired trying to enforce the same non-compete, under more or less the same circumstances (Washington-based employee, working remote out of California). In the process I learned a bunch about this non-compete, and in particular about Amazon's behavior with respect to it: as of 2012, they had tried to enforce this non-compete "hundreds" of times -- and to the knowled…

This wouldn't be able to happen in EU as well. Previous employer can't force you to not being able to offer your services in the job market. They can pay you instead.

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#97

Post by Supermancho »

Judgmentality wrote: post #27
em-bee wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

don't need a snitch. they can just assume that it happens and sue anyways. the difficult part is coming up with proof that it actually happened

So you think it's a good idea to take legal action against someone with no proof and hope it just materializes over time? I mean, I can sue you for stealing US nuclear secrets. Now if only I had some evidence...

> So you think it's a good idea to take legal action against someone with no proof and hope it just materializes over time?

Fishing expeditions are common and sometimes...legendary cough SCO-Linux dispute

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#98

Post by kyawzazaw »

swyx wrote: post #4

i'm honestly just curious about the legal strategy at this point. Has Amazon won any of these suits?

Yup, won to varying degrees.

More similar lawsuits here: https://www.geekwire.com/2019/judge-limits-role-former-amazo...

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#99

Post by perl4ever »

jedberg wrote: post #37

You know you're cool when you need a lawyer to change jobs. I think it would be reasonable to allow non-competes, however, the company should have to keep paying you your full compensation (salary, stock, bonuses, etc) for as long as they keep you from being employed. Sure, give the old employer veto power for a new job as long as they keep paying them for the lockout period.

"Why Janitors Get Noncompete Agreements, Too"

https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/blogs/sta...

"Jimmy John’s drops noncompete clauses following settlement"

https://www.cnbc.com/2016/06/22/jimmy-johns-drops-non-compet...

Re: Amazon sues former AWS marketing VP Brian Hall after he takes Google Cloud job

#100

Post by Supermancho »

ponker wrote: post #17

The text of the contract is unambiguous. If you didn't like it, you shouldn't have signed it.

> The text of the contract is unambiguous.

Text is often ambiguous or can be interpreted to be ambiguous. Tort law isn't as simple as "read the document and make a judgement".

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