Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds • Hacker News Board

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#31

Post by supernova87a » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 4:51 PM UTC

Well, it's hard to compete with the generation that grew up in post-war and full growth economy, fueled by huge technology gains and a country open to expansion. It was like all you had to do to have a good life was... be alive.

Things get less giddy and boundless (for people on the whole) when a country reaches middle age and there's not new jobs just for the asking. When people reminisce about "how resilient and capable we were back then", just remember that nothing hurts too bad when you've got a free ride on an elevator to the top floor.

And now consider southern Europe where it's our situation and wages are 1/2 what we have (though with more social services to take up the slack).

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#32

Post by jbay808 » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 4:52 PM UTC

Mirioron wrote: post #13

robbyt wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's great you've been successful. However, since your story doesn't mirror the majority of your peers, consider yourself an outlier. What can you do to help more people become as financially successful as you are?

The parent poster's point is that life has significantly improved in ways that aren't easily expressed through monetary value. If you lived in the 70s you could not have the convenience of a smartphone no matter how rich you were. People living in the 70s didn't have the ability to use a smartphone, use wikipedia, play video games, post on social media. You could've been the richest person that has ever lived and you…

My smartphone is in many ways a curse and a burden, but I need to carry it because I'm expected to answer phone calls within seconds no matter where I am, and text messages within minutes.

In the '90s, I could go out for a whole weekend and come home and check my answering machine and nobody would be offended, because that was the norm.

I could still opt to live like that now, but the repercussions would be much more severe, because the competitive landscape has shifted.

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#33

Post by api » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 4:54 PM UTC

Jeema101 wrote: post #30

api wrote: post #19

I am so nostalgic for the 1990s. I am a young Xer, almost an old millennial, kind of on the cusp. I've wondered if this is a cognitive artifact of my age in the 90s, teens to 20, but I have asked older and even a few younger people and many have also expressed nostalgia for that decade. Boomers and much older Xers often agree. My teens were rough anyway. It was not my personal best decade, but I would go back in a se…

I think I am about the same age as you and agree completely. That optimistic world of the 90s (and 80s IMO) no longer exists. The country never did recover from 9/11 and has stumbled from one crisis to the next ever since - the War on Terror, Iraq War, Katrina, oil crisis, subprime mortgage meltdown, Occupy Wall St, college tuition debt crisis, and now the pandemic and current protests. Where it all ends I don't know…

The thing is nothing much actually changed, at least not physically. We lost a few thousand people and some buildings. More people die every year of the flu. Covid has killed over 50X 9/11 and yet 9/11 felt like a much more profound loss of... something.

It's all in our heads.

Digging out is going to be tough though because the shift was profound and deep. I don't think we can go back. That's not exactly what I'm saying. What I'm wondering is if we can go forward.

Going forward always involves a bit of going back. Some of the 90s optimism was resurrected 60s optimism. But it also involves invention of new things.

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#34

Post by Proven » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 4:54 PM UTC

netsectoday wrote: post #7

Reading this article as a millennial really hits home as I remember entering the workforce as a teenager mid 2001 as soon as I could drive (months before 9/11), re-entering the workforce as a young adult early 2008 as soon as I had a degree (months before the great recession), then building a company as an adult for two years and launching it January 2020 (months before the end of the world). There have been no break…

Or you could have picked a low-risk (government, perhaps) job and avoided the drama... But it's a hard choice to make when you want to become a millionaire.

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#35

Post by ghiculescu » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 4:57 PM UTC

4636760295 wrote: post #28

Yeah, this makes sense. I got it especially bad, since I joined startups that raised a huge amount of money on promises of riches, and then failed after burning through hundreds of millions of dollars. The founders cashed out before the companies imploded, but regular employees were left holding the bag. I have lots of illiquid startup stock that's now worthless, after about 10 years in Silicon Valley. I do feel like…

If you were fortunate enough to get multiple jobs in Silicon Valley - even if they didn’t go as well as they could have - it’s hard to honestly claim the cards are stacked against you. Most people drew a much weaker hand.

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#36

Post by gold_age » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 4:57 PM UTC

voisin wrote: post #27

netsectoday wrote: post #7

Reading this article as a millennial really hits home as I remember entering the workforce as a teenager mid 2001 as soon as I could drive (months before 9/11), re-entering the workforce as a young adult early 2008 as soon as I had a degree (months before the great recession), then building a company as an adult for two years and launching it January 2020 (months before the end of the world). There have been no break…

Fellow millennial at apparently the same age. I agree with your sentiment. I remind myself that what goes around comes around. Boomers and GenXers bid housing prices up to absurd levels and stayed working longer than past generations (mainly because they failed to save when they could have and have to service debt that is unheard of in past generations). Eventually these assets will be poured back into the market and…

> wealth will disperse.

Wealth doesn't necessarily disperse. See simulation by Norvig:

https://nbviewer.jupyter.org/url/norvig.com/ipython/Economic...

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#37

Post by game_the0ry » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 5:00 PM UTC

api wrote: post #19

I am so nostalgic for the 1990s. I am a young Xer, almost an old millennial, kind of on the cusp. I've wondered if this is a cognitive artifact of my age in the 90s, teens to 20, but I have asked older and even a few younger people and many have also expressed nostalgia for that decade. Boomers and much older Xers often agree. My teens were rough anyway. It was not my personal best decade, but I would go back in a se…

Re: 9/11

You and I are in agreement - that day set the tone for America's future in:

* economics - on his way back to the fed reserve in NYC via helicopter in autumn 2001, Greenspan saw the rubble of WTC and decided to drop the fed funds rate, and it eventually hit 1% in 2004, which is why asset prices (real estate, stocks, bonds) are so high today and why we had a housing boom during that time (2004-2008)

* international policy - never ending war on "terror" (not that they decided on "terror" bc when you have a war on a country, you can define the end of the war; a war on "terror" can go on forever bc you can redefine "terror")

* culture / politics - democrat vs republican (and media fed into it bc it culture wars drive ratings)

Yeah...looks like al qaeda did more damage than we thought.

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#38

Post by game_the0ry » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 5:04 PM UTC

I made this comment on a thread about people having fewer babies nowadays, and I think its relevant here:

Millenial here, born in mid-80s. Have seen or experienced: > dot-com boom / bust (junior high)

> 9/11 (high school)

> War on Terror (college)

> student loans (probably for the rest of my life)

> the worst recession since the Great Depression, and the lasting economic / career effects that never goes away when you go through that (right when I graduated college)

> the divisive culture wars between old / young, rich / poor, establishment / anti-establishment, etc

> Trump as president

> Covid-19

> narcissistic boomer parents

> narcissistic boomers in all levels and areas of institutional leadership whose baseline modus operandi is incompetence, corruption, and greed

> and a lot more that stresses me out

From my perspective, the world is back-sliding - everything feels like its getting worse, not better. Economic data backs this - real wages are level while cost of living is increasing.

And you wonder why we are putting have having children? It's because we do not know what economic optimism and financial security feel like.

Edit - the last 20 years notwithstanding, maybe there is still some things to be optimistic about:

> people are waking up (just look at the comments in this thread)

> mainstream media is finally talking about this

> if you are reading this, you have access to some kind of computing device, which means you're richer than most in the world

All in all, what really sucks is we our standard of living won't be as comfortable as when we were kids, and the same will probably be true for our kids.

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#39

Post by war1025 » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 5:05 PM UTC

ghiculescu wrote: post #35

4636760295 wrote: post #28

Yeah, this makes sense. I got it especially bad, since I joined startups that raised a huge amount of money on promises of riches, and then failed after burning through hundreds of millions of dollars. The founders cashed out before the companies imploded, but regular employees were left holding the bag. I have lots of illiquid startup stock that's now worthless, after about 10 years in Silicon Valley. I do feel like…

If you were fortunate enough to get multiple jobs in Silicon Valley - even if they didn’t go as well as they could have - it’s hard to honestly claim the cards are stacked against you. Most people drew a much weaker hand.

People have a hard time remembering that if you are in the 51st percentile you're "doing better than most".

I feel like we tend to think more in terms of school grading where even an 80% is "not very good".

Re: Data and graphs showing millenials' bad economic odds

#40

Post by 4636760295 » Sun, Jun 07, 2020, 5:05 PM UTC

ghiculescu wrote: post #35

4636760295 wrote: post #28

Yeah, this makes sense. I got it especially bad, since I joined startups that raised a huge amount of money on promises of riches, and then failed after burning through hundreds of millions of dollars. The founders cashed out before the companies imploded, but regular employees were left holding the bag. I have lots of illiquid startup stock that's now worthless, after about 10 years in Silicon Valley. I do feel like…

If you were fortunate enough to get multiple jobs in Silicon Valley - even if they didn’t go as well as they could have - it’s hard to honestly claim the cards are stacked against you. Most people drew a much weaker hand.

That's fair, I am well aware of my luck in this case. I guess I just wish that someone had explained to me the real value of SV lottery tickets when I was younger.

FWIW I grew up poor, and am certainly not wealthy now (I'm still a wage slave), but at least I can afford to buy food and new clothes. Growing up I had to rely on charity.