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Looking back at how Signal works

signal.org

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Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#71

Post by dane-pgp »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #53
bilal4hmed wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

at least on Android you can sideload it

I recall reading something recently about how in a coming release, Android will disable sideloading. The sole permitted way to sideload will be to enable ADB and then install the app with adb install. Some techies will continue to do that, just like some people unlock the bootloader and install LineageOS on their device, but removing Signal from the Play Store would make it as good as dead for the general public. (Ev…

> I recall reading something recently about how in a coming release, Android will disable sideloading.

I guess this is what you're referring to:

https://9to5google.com/2019/12/06/google-advanced-protection...

"Given that these features are already functional once enabled, it may not be long before the sideload protections arrive for those who enrolled in the Advanced Protection Program."

Perhaps developers will one day be required to provide proof of ID to Apple or Google before being allowed to carry out the "dangerous" activity of installing unapproved software.

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#72

Post by chrononaut »

clarkmoody wrote: post #55

The anti-Signal rhetoric has already started. News articles about Antifa specifically mention that they communicate via Signal. If Antifa is designated as a terrorist organization, then we'll see all the counter-terrorism tools brought to bear against them. If the state can't break Signal encryption, then you'll see renewed energy for anti-encryption / anti-privacy policies.

My intuition would say that I would doubt this would change much in terms of investment. Of course without specific knowledge I would suspect that there are terrorist organizations in the world already using Signal such that resources are already being spent doing what you describe. I would also suspect that for any and all cryptographic applications.

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#73

Post by lliamander »

Gys wrote: post #2

> how we think about concepts like privacy, security, and trust I was disappointed to see that a mobile number is needed and that this number is shown by default in groups. Mobile numbers are much more trackable then email addresses in my opinion. And I do not understand at all why others should be able to see them so easily. So I now prefer Telegram because at least it hides numbers in groups by default.

As I understand it, the purpose of using telephone numbers is that it can use the contact list stored on your phone without having to store contact lists on their servers.

Contact lists can be useful information for an attacker. If Signal doesn't have it, it can't be taken from them.

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#74

Post by losvedir »

Is it worth trying to move my friends from WhatsApp to Signal? As I understand it, they're both e2e encrypted.

I'm also trying to move my chats from SMS and Gchat to something encrypted, but am torn between WhatsApp and Signal. The former has more of a buy-in with my contacts already.

I realize WhatsApp is owned by Facebook, but isn't the whole point of e2e encryption that you don't have to trust the intermediate infrastructure? And if you enable the setting to warn if the key changes, there's no danger, right?

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#75

Post by chrononaut »

s17n wrote: post #23
DaftDank wrote: post #17

What happens to Signal when the EARN It Act passes? I assume that eventually the Apple App Store and Google Play Store will just stop allowing it to be downloaded if they do not add the backdoor in? Is there a workaround that will allow people to use it still? I've heard people mention locating the servers in other countries, but wouldn't the various App stores be bound by US law and still not allow them?

I don't think that the earn it act will affect Signal - they aren't a publisher by any reasonable standard so they don't need the 230 exemption in the first place.

As I don't know much of the details of the legislation, or more importantly its references or modifications, can you elaborate more on what "they don't need the 230 exemption" means in the context that this act would likely not apply to them? Are you implying that the EARN IT act focuses on publishers of content and thus it less likely apply to Signal?

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#76

Post by kasey_junk »

losvedir wrote: post #74

Is it worth trying to move my friends from WhatsApp to Signal? As I understand it, they're both e2e encrypted. I'm also trying to move my chats from SMS and Gchat to something encrypted, but am torn between WhatsApp and Signal. The former has more of a buy-in with my contacts already. I realize WhatsApp is owned by Facebook, but isn't the whole point of e2e encryption that you don't have to trust the intermediate inf…

The metadata is the difference. Your contact graph is fair game on WhatsApp for Facebook

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#77

Post by troughway »

clarkmoody wrote: post #55

The anti-Signal rhetoric has already started. News articles about Antifa specifically mention that they communicate via Signal. If Antifa is designated as a terrorist organization, then we'll see all the counter-terrorism tools brought to bear against them. If the state can't break Signal encryption, then you'll see renewed energy for anti-encryption / anti-privacy policies.

Why would antifa result in anti-signal rhetoric?

Genuine question because antifa is a mixed bag - there isn’t really any consensus on whether what they do is good or bad. Seems to be all over the damn place.

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#78

Post by sdjkfgsdjkfghjh »

gonehome wrote: post #26
K2L8M11N2 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In most European countries you need to submit your ID to get any sort of working SIM card.

If that’s the case doesn’t it matter even less that signal requires it since it’s already known anyway? Signal’s use of phone numbers as IDs means they don’t have to have any of your contacts sent to their servers. As shown in the article they have no metadata and nothing to reveal beyond your phone number and when you signed up. These other apps send your social graph to their servers, track and store metadata, don’…

Just do like TOR services. Hash some garbage with your private key. done.

This is no excuse other than copying the leading app for no good reason.

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#79

Post by Cenk »

troughway wrote: post #77
clarkmoody wrote: post #55

The anti-Signal rhetoric has already started. News articles about Antifa specifically mention that they communicate via Signal. If Antifa is designated as a terrorist organization, then we'll see all the counter-terrorism tools brought to bear against them. If the state can't break Signal encryption, then you'll see renewed energy for anti-encryption / anti-privacy policies.

Why would antifa result in anti-signal rhetoric? Genuine question because antifa is a mixed bag - there isn’t really any consensus on whether what they do is good or bad. Seems to be all over the damn place.

There is no consensus on wether being against fascism is good or bad? Being against fascism is not a group or organisation. It’s like calling bird watching an organisation. Yes, there are bird watching organisations, as there are antifa organisations, but neither bird watching nor antifa is an organisation.

Re: Looking back at how Signal works

#80

Post by windthrown »

bogwog wrote: post #41

Anyone have information about how/where they get their funding and/or income?

They are funded by the Signal Foundation: https://signal.org/blog/signal-foundation/

"...Today, we are launching the Signal Foundation, an emerging 501(c)(3) nonprofit created and made possible by Brian Acton, the co-founder of WhatsApp, to support, accelerate, and broaden Signal’s mission of making private communication accessible and ubiquitous. In case you missed it, Brian left WhatsApp and Facebook last year, and has been thinking about how to best focus his future time and energy on building nonprofit technology for public good.

Starting with an initial $50,000,000 in funding, we can now increase the size of our team, our capacity, and our ambitions. This means reduced uncertainty on the path to sustainability, and the strengthening of our long-term goals and values. Perhaps most significantly, the addition of Brian brings an incredibly talented engineer and visionary with decades of experience building successful products to our team."

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