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More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

businessinsider.com

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Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#131

Post by dvtrn »

crazygringo wrote: post #102
ikeyany wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fragile ... the word is fragile. We've built an insanely fragile economy. Take a look. There's been no war. 100% of the (not so great) US infrastructure that was there before SARS-COV-2 is still there. We've lost about 100k people, which is horrific but in the scheme of things at "USA" scale, and with the skewed demographics, not much of a hit to the economy. And yet the economy is staggering and it's likely to get…

> We've built an insanely fragile economy. Citation needed. Things seem to be functioning pretty well, all things considered. I can still buy virtually everything I need from the local grocery store and Amazon. I've lived in third-world countries where regular products would be out of stock for months at a time under normal circumstances. To me, the economy looks insanely resilient in a global pandemic. > the mere fa…

If you want to have a conversation, the one to have is about social safety nets, not an "economic resilience" bogeyman.

Porque no los dos? You say you've lived in third-world countries, surely you can see the utility in a conversation on both and how much overlap there is between the two hemispheres of that particular socio-economic Venn Diagram..I'd hope?

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#132

Post by jchrisa »

5ociety wrote: post #13
jdm2212 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole banking system would collapse like in 2007-2008 because "everyone stops paying mortgages all at once" is basically what happened then. Renters stop paying their rent so landlords go broke. Landlords stop paying their mortgages. Mortgage-backed securities go into default. Anyone with lots of exposure to mortgage-backed securities folds. Their counterparties in all sorts of financial arrangements can't collec…

It kind of sounds like we need a different money system?

I like Holochain as they don't maintain a global ledger. Here is some reasoning why: https://www.wired.com/2014/07/document-coin/

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#133

Post by ecnahc515 »

airza wrote: post #97
munificent wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One to look at rent is that it's like the old joke about prostitution: you don't pay for the sex, you pay for them to leave afterwards. Rent gives you greater location flexibility and less commitment to a specific place and building. You don't have to maintain it yourself, and you are freed from the mental load of having to do long-term planning around it at all. Not that it's necessarily good for the surrounding com…

I can see the argument about flexibility, but it doesn't really seem to mesh up with the skyrocketing demand for rental properties in urban areas. On the other hand, I'm not sure why the service of removing risk from home ownership is good (or why it couldn't be separated into ownership and property management.) In the paradigm you're proposing, the renter wants to be insulated from the risk of property damage or adv…

This isn't all that different then how a person chooses to work for a company rather than run a company themselves.

People often dread working for others, but still do it because the risk and difficulties of running a business themselves aren't worth the ability to easily change jobs/roles/location that working for someone else allows.

If you own a house or business, if something goes wrong, you have to fix it, or sell the asset so it's not your problem anymore. If you rent/work for someone else you simply move/work somewhere else.

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#134

Post by em500 »

airza wrote: post #82
sokoloff wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who would rather buy houses than rent should feel free to do so. No landlord is forcing someone to rent their property. It is often the case that renting is quite a bit cheaper and always the case that it's more flexible to do so, which is why a lot of people choose to rent instead of buying. Society benefits when people who wish to rent housing have housing available for lease.

It's certainly more feasible to rent if you don't have the money to buy a house, which is why every single renter i know is doing do. I'm just not sure why this is necessary or a valuable economic innovation that justifies the rent paid.

You're not sure why it's a valuable economic innovation that people who don't have the money to buy a house can rent one? What alternative are you suggesting, that they should get a house for free?

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#135

Post by uoaei »

ojnabieoot wrote: post #127
ikeyany wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fragile ... the word is fragile. We've built an insanely fragile economy. Take a look. There's been no war. 100% of the (not so great) US infrastructure that was there before SARS-COV-2 is still there. We've lost about 100k people, which is horrific but in the scheme of things at "USA" scale, and with the skewed demographics, not much of a hit to the economy. And yet the economy is staggering and it's likely to get…

> Why? Because people have stopped doing things > We've built an entire economy around people doing things they don't really need to do. Even hunter-gatherers spend a great deal of hard-earned resources on things "they don't need to do," such as art, music, parties, luxury foods and jewelry, and so on. This is human nature. It has nothing to do with how the economy is structured. The stuff we're not doing that "we do…

I think you missed the point. If I understood GP correctly, the "things they don't really need to do" are the modern-day pencil pushers and middlemen who exist in industries that are basically modernized rent-seeking. Health insurance is an obvious example but we can also take it to the extreme and point out that there are sometimes (not often) 3 people at some grocery checkout counters: the cashier, the bagger, and the person who takes the bags and puts them in the basket.

The latter two aren't really necessary, but we gave them jobs because it looks good when you report the quarterly unemployment stats. Think about who would be the first to be let go in the case of any economic disruption that impacted that grocery store.

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#136

Post by Nasrudith »

jawns wrote: post #38

It feels like a huge wave just crashed, and many people standing waist-deep in the water think things are on the upswing now -- when really they're about to get sucked into a powerful undertow. Judging by the state of the stock market, many investors seem oblivious to the magnitude of the effects of the pandemic. The S&P 500 lost more than a third of its value in the pandemic crash. Yet the index is now two-thirds of…

I suspect part of the reason why the prices are staying higher is lack of alternative places to put the money and with no pull out the drop is somewhat limited.

And I am of the opinion that it feels like prices should have dropped more and feeling a bit guiltily disappointed at the lack of a crash for investing opportunities. That and a confused "Why does my portfolio keep on rising now of all times?"

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#137

Post by postingawayonhn »

chkaloon wrote: post #120
aazaa wrote: post #37

> Bed Bath & Beyond, Famous Footwear, H&M, and the Gap, AMC and Regal movie theaters, and 24 Hour Fitness gyms have all missed payments, jeopardizing the stability of their property management companies and municipal governments that rely on property taxes, The Post's Heather Long reported. All roads lead to the Federal Reserve. Stores defaulting on rent payments starves landlords for cash. Landlords unable to servic…

Regarding #2, or rather inflation, is it a hidden way to transfer wealth from one generation to the next? Older savers see their wealth dissolve away due to inflation, while the younger generations are held somewhat stable by rising wages. It's unfortunate, but probably the least painful way out of this.

Assets prices are inflating more than anything else. If your savings are in stocks or possibly property you're likely doing quite well.

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#138

Post by nine_zeros »

aazaa wrote: post #37

> Bed Bath & Beyond, Famous Footwear, H&M, and the Gap, AMC and Regal movie theaters, and 24 Hour Fitness gyms have all missed payments, jeopardizing the stability of their property management companies and municipal governments that rely on property taxes, The Post's Heather Long reported. All roads lead to the Federal Reserve. Stores defaulting on rent payments starves landlords for cash. Landlords unable to servic…

> 2. Currency depreciation.

This is likely going to be the outcome. All the savers will ultimately be shafted, as was done in times we moved off of gold standard.

The real cost of living will just keep rising as many jobs just won't come back despite this printing of money.

Re: More than half of American retailers didn't pay their rent in April and May

#139

Post by em500 »

airza wrote: post #77
nradov wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone who wants to buy a rental house is free to do so. Just make an unsolicited purchase offer to the landlord for more than the net present value of all expected future rental income. Most landlords are willing to sell their properties, even when they're not currently listed on the market.

I'm sure the landlord is getting a lot of value from their rental property, but why is this configuration of property ownership better for society?

Better for society than what other configuration of property ownership? What other allocation mechanism for shelter are you suggesting?
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