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Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

news.harvard.edu

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Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#51

Post by rayiner »

noetic_techy wrote: post #45
rayiner wrote: post #21

The problem is that “verifiable fact” is actually very complicated in any context where you’re talking about politics. Two of the questions on the first graphic are about income mobility for people born in the bottom quantile. The graphic is correct, as far as it goes, but overlooks huge differences by race. While the average American born in the bottom 20% has a 7.8% chance of reaching the top 20%, that number is ac…

> While the average American born in the bottom 20% has a 7.8% chance of reaching the top 20%, that number is actually 25% for Asians. Exactly. Amy Chau wrote a great book called The Triple Package that points this out and the fact that its not just Asians (which broadly lumps Indians and all other Asian cultures together): Nigerian immigrants, Cuban exiles, Lebonese, Mormons, Iranians, Jews, all see roughly the same…

> Its considered taboo to point out that income inequality is largely cultural.

I wouldn't say "cultural" because that's pretty loaded. My point is more that if there were something structural about the economy that kept people in their class (big banks, bad public education, etc.) you wouldn't see high mobility in certain sub-groups. There has to be other factors in play--who knows what they are. But I wouldn't assume they're necessarily "cultural."

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#52

Post by rayiner »

riskable wrote: post #38
autokad wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't believe they thought it was that high. I mean general unemployment is no where near 27% and you'd suspect that with threat of losing visa status, immigrants are more likelier to take a job they dont exactly grok.

When arguing about immigrants and unemployment I always wondered why people get so upset over it. If the immigrant is even able to collect unemployment that means they paid for it . So they're literally just getting the money back that they paid into it. Probably considerably less, even! So why should anyone care that they're collecting a benefit that they paid for? I don't get it.

Unemployment doesn't work like that. As long as you've paid something in, you can get paid out the same as anyone else. So you could have a situation where non-immigrants are paying into the system more than they get out, while immigrants are getting paid more than they paid in.

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#53

Post by caseyohara »

codeddesign wrote: post #44
riskable wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When arguing about immigrants and unemployment I always wondered why people get so upset over it. If the immigrant is even able to collect unemployment that means they paid for it . So they're literally just getting the money back that they paid into it. Probably considerably less, even! So why should anyone care that they're collecting a benefit that they paid for? I don't get it.

Unfortunately all media is biased, with most primarily taking a far left stance. This is likely just due to $$$ as we live in a capitalist society. If I owned a news station the questions I would ask is “what demographic is the most profitable to us?” and “what content brings in the most money?”

You are gravely mistaken if you think news stations slant "far left".

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#54

Post by klyrs »

jacobwilliamroy wrote: post #30
xkapastel wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Breathing affecting health in that way was absolutely news to me. I'm very skeptical that you really could have predicted the results of that study before reading it. In fact, your post on that story was: > Did you all know that humans need oxygen to survive? And that the ways we consume oxygen can affect our health? It doesn't seem like you really understood what they were saying. It's much more complicated than thi…

Human cells use oxygen for fuel. Breathing is the primary mechanism by which oxygen enters the cells. My teacher told me this stuff when I was a baby in elementary school.

Wow, those scientists went to the wrong elementary school. You sound smart, they usually don't even let toddlers into elementary school, much less babies.

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#55

Post by HeroOfAges »

caseyohara wrote: post #53
codeddesign wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately all media is biased, with most primarily taking a far left stance. This is likely just due to $$$ as we live in a capitalist society. If I owned a news station the questions I would ask is “what demographic is the most profitable to us?” and “what content brings in the most money?”

You are gravely mistaken if you think news stations slant "far left".

Are you referring to local news stations or national networks? I've also suspected CNN and MSNBC have a bias toward the "far left". What would you, caseyohara, accept as proof of left-leaning bias from CNN or MSNBC?

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#56

Post by bobwaycott »

HeroOfAges wrote: post #55
caseyohara wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are gravely mistaken if you think news stations slant "far left".

Are you referring to local news stations or national networks? I've also suspected CNN and MSNBC have a bias toward the "far left". What would you, caseyohara, accept as proof of left-leaning bias from CNN or MSNBC?

There is a significant difference between being left-leaning, and being far-left.

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#57

Post by notahacker »

HeroOfAges wrote: post #55
caseyohara wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are gravely mistaken if you think news stations slant "far left".

Are you referring to local news stations or national networks? I've also suspected CNN and MSNBC have a bias toward the "far left". What would you, caseyohara, accept as proof of left-leaning bias from CNN or MSNBC?

Typically, a source with a bias towards the "far left" might be inclined to agitate for Marxist revolution or anarcho-syndicalism and consider European social democrats to be right wing sellouts because they haven't shown any inclination to abolish private property or even punitively tax the rich. Do you have any evidence of this bias in their news coverage?

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#58

Post by skeletor_999 »

rayiner wrote: post #51
noetic_techy wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While the average American born in the bottom 20% has a 7.8% chance of reaching the top 20%, that number is actually 25% for Asians. Exactly. Amy Chau wrote a great book called The Triple Package that points this out and the fact that its not just Asians (which broadly lumps Indians and all other Asian cultures together): Nigerian immigrants, Cuban exiles, Lebonese, Mormons, Iranians, Jews, all see roughly the same…

> Its considered taboo to point out that income inequality is largely cultural. I wouldn't say "cultural" because that's pretty loaded. My point is more that if there were something structural about the economy that kept people in their class (big banks, bad public education, etc.) you wouldn't see high mobility in certain sub-groups. There has to be other factors in play--who knows what they are. But I wouldn't assu…

> I wouldn't say "cultural" because that's pretty loaded.

It may be loaded, but our cultural differences need to be considered. On average Asian and Indian cultures place a stronger emphasis on grades. This plays a large role in why they have been very successful by some metrics. If certain questions are taboo, then we might overlook factors that are setting them back. That doesn't mean that external factors aren't relevant, but we need to consider everything.

We need to ask uncomfortable questions. That's not bigoted in itself. Look at the gay community. A lot of gay men engage in very risky behaviour that can lead to the spread of STIs. As an LGBT person myself, I can tell you that it is still quite common. We need to be able to ask if they are doing self harm. In fact, we have asked these questions, which has led to measurable progress (STI prevention strategies have helped significantly).

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#59

Post by clarkmoody »

phkahler wrote: post #39
Leary wrote: post #8

What share of US immigrants receive unemployment? Democrats: 25.6% Republicans: 27.1% Reality: 5.5% It seems the bigger bias comes from the general media than any particular party political bias.

>> It seems the bigger bias comes from the general media than any particular party political bias. From TFA: >> First and foremost, Republicans and Democrats tend to seek out very different news sources so they often get very different information. It should raise red flags for everyone that news sources vary so much on reporting the same thing. We should be selecting news sources based on the types of things they re…

Every statistic may be manipulated.

Two versions of the same data:

- Bad outcome X rose by 55% over last year (under Party Y, those scoundrels)

- Bad outcome X affected 17 people this year, up from 11 last year, out of a population of 35 million

Re: Study finds political bias skews perceptions of verifiable fact

#60

Post by T-hawk »

3pt14159 wrote: post #42
autokad wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't believe they thought it was that high. I mean general unemployment is no where near 27% and you'd suspect that with threat of losing visa status, immigrants are more likelier to take a job they dont exactly grok.

The question is a bit ambiguous though. I could see people thinking "I'm sure a quarter of them have been on it at some point" rather than hearing the question as "what percentage of immigrants are on unemployment at the present time?"

The "umemployment" part of the question can also be heard incorrectly. Unemployment properly refers to a specific benefit paid out after loss of a job. But I'd bet many respondents mentally generalized from that to many other types of public assistance and welfare.
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