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Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

cbc.ca

171–180 of 200 posts

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#171
post #160

Canadians don't realize how high their telco bills are because that's their reality they don't know prices elsewhere and the closest neighbour have also high prices

Oh we realize they are extremely expensive, unfortunately there isn't much we can do to increase telco competition with the current regulatory boards such as CRTC.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just goes to show that Canadian telecom policy is controlled by telecoms, not by the government. It's very cozy and regularly functions to discourage competition. It's easy to say that, but Canada has a smaller population than California, but spread over the surface area larger than that of the United States. How many carriers, and how much competition, can you possibly expect in that environment? Especially in an…

> It's easy to say that, but Canada has a smaller population than California, but spread over the surface area larger than that of the United States. That is an extremely misleading statement. Approximately 75% of Canada's population lives within 150km of the US border, and even that is not a uniform distribution , there are dense urban population clusters.

And even then, most of the Canadian population are East, and South -- "South" in a Canadian sense.

Around 30% of the total Canadian population is in the Greater Toronto Area, and if you toss in the most populous Quebecois (Montreal-Trois-Rivieres-Quebec) cities that number is around 50%.[1]

You see the same thing in the US and Australia as well -- the Eastern coasts were settled first, and that's where the population is to this day.[2]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_of_Canada_by_provin... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northeast_megalopolis

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#173
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just goes to show that Canadian telecom policy is controlled by telecoms, not by the government. It's very cozy and regularly functions to discourage competition. Canadian telecom policy still revolves around "facilities-based competition", where it's believed that new entrants should build out a new network. It's designed to fail. Even the incumbents, Bell and Telus, share a 3G/4G mobile network to avoid redundant i…

People complain about the lack of cell phone providers here in the US, but damn! Canada is way worse. The cost of phone plans is outrageous and the major telecoms do everything in their power to stop new entrants from messing up their gravy train.

I'm not by any means defending the Canadian telecoms, but I'll say one thing about the networks of the big 3: they are rock solid. While visiting Germany, I was impressed by the cheap prepaid data plans, but I only got EDGE in the rural areas and the LTE connections in the cities were not great. At the time I was playing Ingress and I quit in frustration. I was so irritated I even tried Vodafone after trying T-mobile.

In the US* the connections aren't great, either. Not as bad as Germany, but in general I got slower practical speeds almost all over the country (and the big cities like NYC were terrible).

In Canada I got excellent 4G performance when driving the whole way between Saskatoon and Calgary as well as any time I take the train between Toronto and Montreal.

* I've been told Verizon is the best quality network in the States, but I have only been able to get prepaid plans from AT&T and T-Mobile.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#174

Can somebody articulate why using huawei a bad idea beside it’s a Chinese company and using those equipments gives China backdoor access into critical systems and everything it connects to. Or is that basically it? I am trying to understand this objectively as if sitting on mars why this is a good or bad idea.

AFAIK, most companies weren’t even planning on using Huawei equipment, they used the threat to lower prices from other suppliers, and then those suppliers countered that by getting Huawei banned through lobbying.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#175
As a Canadian, I would say that if Huawei was not selected due to issues relating to national security -- then why not take some time to setup a crown corporation / Government-owned company and have them develop indigenous hardware/software for 5G networks?

I am sure if Canadians can develop their own smartphones, space mission components (Canada arm) and airplanes, they can develop 5G network equipment.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#176

Can somebody articulate why using huawei a bad idea beside it’s a Chinese company and using those equipments gives China backdoor access into critical systems and everything it connects to. Or is that basically it? I am trying to understand this objectively as if sitting on mars why this is a good or bad idea.

I think we're learning the value of being self sufficient and the downsides of globalizing everything all the time. When the next [cold, hot, trade] war starts, it will pay to have the expertise to run your own infrastructure.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#177
post #2

has anyone had to hear their crazy relatives go on about the dangers of 5G? Is there some penultimate youtube video or resource to point people to to assuage their fears?

I don't know what you meant by "penultimate", perhaps indisputable? But if you don't know of such a resource, how are you so convinced they're wrong? Margarine (with its trans fats) was declared healthy and safe for a long time, until it wasn't.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#178
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does ARM count as an alternative? I guess not since it's still mostly American companies actually producing products with the designs.

ARM was entirely bought by Japans Softbank during the currency slump that followed the brexit referendum result[0], since then softbank has sold majority shares to Chinese companies[1][2]. ARM Holdings is predominantly Chinese now. [0]: https://www.theverge.com/2016/9/5/12798302/softbank-arm-acqu... [1]: https://www.theregister.com/2018/06/06/softbank_offloads_51_... [2]: https://www.bbc.com/news/business-39204744

Apologies, I was answering in the context of an alternative to North American dominance in the CPU industry rather than European equivalents.

But I didn't realise Softbank had sold on their $31bn stake. The BBC article states a $8bn chunk went to a Saudi-backed investment group, and the other sale was the majority stake of only ARM's Chinese subsidiary (worth $775.2m). From that it doesn't seem accurate to say ARM is now predominantly Chinese but maybe there are some other deals I also missed. To be honest, I lost interest once they sold to Softbank - 'in the country's interests' ha!

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have 4 lines with TMobile and pay $140 a month. https://www.t-mobile.com/cell-phone-plans/magenta Unlimited everything... Even 5 gig of data when in Canada. I don't think Rogers, Telus or Bell have anything close to that.

I was running the numbers based on a single line. Didn't bother doing the family plan options, but I do know the big3 in Canada have family plan options too. TMo is even in the US as huge outlier. I too enjoy a $40/mth unlimited plan with 5 of my favorite loose affiliates.

Not really family plans these days. Any additional lines are charged as normal and you just get the convenience of a single bill - no discount.

Or at least that's what the rogers rep told me.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#180
The carriers had every plan to use Huawei, the cost savings would drive far better profit margins and faster rollout for the same capital investment.

However, with the extradition situation with Meng and the threats from the CCP, it is clear that it isn't possible to do business with the company. The risk of a future need to tear out and replace Huawei product due to geo-political/ cyber-warfare in the future outweighs the savings from dealing with Ericsson or Nokia.

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