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Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

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Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#71

Post by arcticbull »

hourislate wrote: post #69
arcticbull wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really though? I mean, it used to be. Rogers wants $75/mth (CAD - $55 USD) for 10GB data and unlimited talk and text. Let's compare to the US: - AT&T wants 65++ USD ($87 CAD) for a comparable plan. - Verizon wants 70++ USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. - TMo wants 70 (all in) USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. And each network in Canada is dramatically better than AT&T and TMo, and roughly comparable to Ve…

I have 4 lines with TMobile and pay $140 a month. https://www.t-mobile.com/cell-phone-plans/magenta Unlimited everything... Even 5 gig of data when in Canada. I don't think Rogers, Telus or Bell have anything close to that.

I was running the numbers based on a single line. Didn't bother doing the family plan options, but I do know the big3 in Canada have family plan options too. TMo is even in the US as huge outlier. I too enjoy a $40/mth unlimited plan with 5 of my favorite loose affiliates.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#72

Post by [deleted] »

giomasce wrote: post #67
arcticbull wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really though? I mean, it used to be. Rogers wants $75/mth (CAD - $55 USD) for 10GB data and unlimited talk and text. Let's compare to the US: - AT&T wants 65++ USD ($87 CAD) for a comparable plan. - Verizon wants 70++ USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. - TMo wants 70 (all in) USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. And each network in Canada is dramatically better than AT&T and TMo, and roughly comparable to Ve…

Wow, in Belgium you can get the same for around 15 EUR and in Italy you can get 50 GB for less than 10 EUR...

[deleted]

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#73

Post by Scoundreller »

arcticbull wrote: post #54
refurb wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People complain about the lack of cell phone providers here in the US, but damn! Canada is way worse. The cost of phone plans is outrageous and the major telecoms do everything in their power to stop new entrants from messing up their gravy train.

Is it really though? I mean, it used to be. Rogers wants $75/mth (CAD - $55 USD) for 10GB data and unlimited talk and text. Let's compare to the US: - AT&T wants 65++ USD ($87 CAD) for a comparable plan. - Verizon wants 70++ USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. - TMo wants 70 (all in) USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. And each network in Canada is dramatically better than AT&T and TMo, and roughly comparable to Ve…

Wat? T-Mobile wants US$35 (incl taxes!) for a much better plan. Includes Netflix even. And they only start throttling at 50gb.

https://www.t-mobile.com/cell-phone-plans

The Canadian networks are “better” because every Canadian rations their usage. I’d wager that Canadian networks are wayyyy underprovisioned compared to even the crappiest US network.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#74

Post by Lammy »

Cyph0n wrote: post #61
Lammy wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You probably shouldn't call people "crazy" if you hope to ever bring them around to your viewpoint.

It’s not a viewpoint, it’s a fact. Important difference.

The 'crazies' seem to do an okay job sharing the reality they perceive. Don't limit yourself with a belief that only one viewpoint on a given topic is The One Truth™. A person's sincere belief in something is what that makes that thing true.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#75

Post by justicezyx »

rubatuga wrote: post #39

Bell is already using Huawei components in other parts of their network. When I opened my Bell fiber modem last year, I noticed Bell was using a 1.25 Gbit Huawei SFP+ transceiver. Is there any possibility of a backdoor?

AFAIK there has not been serious technical evidence for backdoors in Huawei products.

I totally agree with the argument that national state should own and control their own infrastructure. But I don't think it actually serves them to use exaggerated claims.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#76

Post by Scoundreller »

arcticbull wrote: post #64
Scoundreller wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd expect rates as good as Iceland's, which has an even lower population density than Canada, and covers a much higher percentage of their country. Canadians could only dream of their rates.

Compare the coverage maps though. They have 199 towers total and cover a tiny, teeny strip of roadway around the perimeter [1]. On the other hand, Bell [2]. I'll give you one guess which of these networks costs more per capita to operate. [1] https://www.cellmapper.net/map?MCC=274&MNC=1&type=LTE&latitu... [2] https://www.bell.ca/Mobility/Our_network_coverage

Coverage 100x the population across 100x the landmass would cost the same per capita.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#77

Post by Scoundreller »

jbay808 wrote: post #46
Scoundreller wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It could easily have been that the Canadian government told the telecoms a long time ago that they wouldn't be allowed to use Huawei, but kept this secret for the sake of contract negotiations. I figure the government ran its Huawei-ban proposal by the telcos and they balked and said: "don't regulate it, we'll just not choose them". It's a direct access to government influence that the public could only dream of. M…

Wouldn't it have been more in their favour to choose Huawei, at presumably much lower cost? It's not like consumers who didn't like that idea could switch to someone else. The only explanation I can think of is that the government called the shots here, while sparing the telecos from a tough negotiating position.

I think the directive came to not use Huawei, and the telecoms structured it as “ok, we just won’t select Huawei” instead of “Gov bans Huawei”.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#78

Post by frequentnapper »

bgee wrote: post #60
Scoundreller wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if Huawei is a Chinese spy, shouldn't the government put some restrictions on that too for public benefit? But they can't with the ban-but-not-a-ban on Huawei. It would be too obvious that there was a ban if providers scrubbed Huawei consumer products entirely, and those consumers pay the price. And while you have the option to not buy them, it's not so easy to avoid communication with anyone with a Huawei device…

Disclaimer: China national working for the American company behind Android; opinions are my own. > But if Huawei is a Chinese spy Has Huawei been caught with a smoking gun? Is Huawei worse in terms of security compared to other telecom suppliers? If (national) security is really Canada's top priority, it seems the most needed ban is on American consumer products/websites [0]? [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM_…

As a Canadian, we have shared values and programmes between our nations in addition to us being neighbours. China on the other hand is a known enemy of those values and seeks actively to undermine our values. That's enough reason for me to support not having Huawei or any other chinese organization controlling any part of our infrastructure.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#79

Post by arcticbull »

Scoundreller wrote: post #73
arcticbull wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really though? I mean, it used to be. Rogers wants $75/mth (CAD - $55 USD) for 10GB data and unlimited talk and text. Let's compare to the US: - AT&T wants 65++ USD ($87 CAD) for a comparable plan. - Verizon wants 70++ USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. - TMo wants 70 (all in) USD ($94 CAD) for a comparable plan. And each network in Canada is dramatically better than AT&T and TMo, and roughly comparable to Ve…

Wat? T-Mobile wants US$35 (incl taxes!) for a much better plan. Includes Netflix even. And they only start throttling at 50gb. https://www.t-mobile.com/cell-phone-plans The Canadian networks are “better” because every Canadian rations their usage. I’d wager that Canadian networks are wayyyy underprovisioned compared to even the crappiest US network.

That's if you want 4 lines.

Check out the top div on that page, you'll see they conveniently want to sign up both you and everyone you know to qualify for that rate. I priced it for a single line in both the US and Canada. With that in mind TMo is a huge outlier in the US, too, and John Legere is responsible for singlehandedly dragging AT&T and VZW kicking and screaming into the 21st century of pricing over the last 5-6 years.

They also have far and away the worst network in the US, trust me, I've used them for years -- and love them. Their network is still hot garbage though. Frankly the best TMobile network you can get is when you roam onto Rogers, Bell or Telus in Canada.

Re: Bell, Telus to use Nokia and Ericsson, not Huawei, in building their 5G networks

#80

Post by Scoundreller »

kevin_nisbet wrote: post #59
humanlion87 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's far more difficult to build a competitive network in Canada vs the US. Canada is as big as the US, but has 1/10th the population. Building and maintaining infrastructure for low-density population areas is extremely capital intensive. I am not saying the existing Telco oligopoly is a good or ideal situation. Just mentioning that US and Canada have some differences in this regard

I agree with you in concept, but I don't know that the geography fully explains the discrepancy. As an example, there are government incentives to do the build out to more rural areas, but that might be true in the US as well. We also tried to implement more carriers several years ago, with a wireless spectrum auction that reserved spectrum for new entrants. These startups tried to focus solely on urban areas with th…

Wind mobile was doomed because they were issued 1.7ghz spectrum. That’s going to make any urban-area buildout prohibitively expensive because it doesn’t penetrate well.
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