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Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

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Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#581

Post by testbot123 »

ABeeSea wrote: post #499
jascii wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never in my life seen an ambulance be stopped by a protest, nor have ever heard of such an incident ever occuring.

The armed right-wing lockdown protestors blocked an ambulance. And a right-wing governor threw a tantrum that blocked ambulances.

Not sure why you're being downvoted. There is documented evidence of this:

> "To see this - traffic blocking the main intersection of a level 1 trauma centre, blocking the entrance and exit to our hospital. Blocking patients from receiving care that they need, makes me angry. It hurts. It hurts a lot," said one healthcare worker on Facebook.

> WLNS reports another posting: "You are currently blocking ambulances, physicians and caregivers from making it to work to care for the sick and relieve the exhausted workers.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic...

Quotes a local news story: https://www.wlns.com/news/health/coronavirus/capitol-protest...

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#582

Post by MisterBastahrd »

rpiguy wrote: post #429
MisterBastahrd wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate to break it to you, but the Boston Tea Party that conservatives were so fond of hijacking for their own partisan purposes destroyed over a million US dollars (in today's money) in other people's property. YOU are comfortable sitting there and "defending property" because it props up a system that benefits you.

And after the revolution the government immediately cracked down on similar tax protests like the Whiskey Rebellion. So what? On its own I agree the Tea Party is wonton vandalism. The patriots knew that too. They wanted to start a war. They also knew it was lawless and it was debated afterwords until it set of a wave of similar vandalism. No one outside of a very small group looks back on the race riots of 1968 with…

The rioters aren't trying to start a revolutionary war. They're trying to start a conversation that will never happen with a bunch of hand holding and song singing.

We're FAR past that point, and the reason that comfortable white people are so taken aback by this is because they've been given the freedom to ignore it all. Just watch the alternate dimension that is OAN or Fox News, and you will never have to worry about how a minority is ever treated in this country, because they will either tell you it's all bullshit or they will wring their hands for a segment and then go right back to bashing Obama or Clinton for things that are happening 3.5 years into Trump's presidency.

RIGHT NOW cops are shooting tear gas and grenades at peaceful protesters.

RIGHT NOW photographers are losing their vision because police officers are firing rubber bullets at their heads.

RIGHT NOW cops are destroying property and blaming it on imaginary groups of paid protesters.

RIGHT NOW cops are hiding their badge numbers because they don't want to get fired.

RIGHT NOW cops are assaulting and arresting the press.

RIGHT NOW cops have the right to wander into a woman's apartment and shoot her stone cold dead because they didn't read the number.

RIGHT NOW people in this country watch with baited breath to see whether people like that woman who murdered Botham Jean in his own home would even get charged.

It seems to me that a large portion of the conservative side of this country is more than happy with "coming down hard" on people to try to scare anyone else from trying to upset the apple cart. Because it "works."

These protesters? They're just reciprocating what "works."

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#583

Post by colejohnson66 »

apazzolini wrote: post #449
itsspring wrote: post #20

When "Freedom of the Press" is under attack, newspapers/press/media have had their legal counsel file lawsuits against the government. But with the demise of revenue for many newspapers (and many going out of business), I wonder if they will take those expensive steps.

Are you aware of a foundation I can donate to that will explicitly use the money in these types of lawsuits against the government?

ACLU?

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#584

Post by jariel »

baseballdork wrote: post #524
jariel wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is absolutely no need for emergency services to track pop-up protests, the very notion is absurd. We don't have the right to block traffic to promote our political opinions. When protestors block traffic, if the city decides they have to go, and they won't - in those situations, it's the protesters who are 'instigating', not the police. NRA 2cnd amendment protestors, pro/anti-abortion protestors, anti-capitalis…

> I would like to invite anyone to define exactly under what conditions people think they have the right to stop traffic at major intersections for hours on end, other than of course signalling to the city beforehand. When peaceful protests have failed to affect change and police brutality (especially for POC) is continuing unabated.

I'll respond to this comment here on behalf of all of the responses to my point:

None of you have provided any reasonably objective definition of what could constitute an otherwise illegal, and sometimes violent protest.

These responses sound a lot like right-wing NRA 2cnd Amendment people barricading in buildings with guns and police surrounding them kind of rhetoric.

All three of the responses (at the time of my response) purport arbitrary definitions of self-determined, extra-judicial action - essentially vigilantism.

Literally, people inventing some cause and then taking over public property, sometimes causing damage, or worse.

If you accept your own definitions of 'legitimate cause' - I'm afraid you're really not going to like what a lot of other Americans would like to protest, just as violently.

If people are going to protest, especially when things can get violent, they're going to have to do so in a way that's not entirely disruptive -> like gather in a park, otherwise, it's just not going to work out.

We don't get to invent the law, no matter how passionate we are about something.

There are just a ton of better ways to create change that are totally within civil and legal framework, and there are many good examples to follow. And especially the rioting is probably counter-productive in almost every sense of the terms.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#585

Post by grandmczeb »

testbot123 wrote: post #581
ABeeSea wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The armed right-wing lockdown protestors blocked an ambulance. And a right-wing governor threw a tantrum that blocked ambulances.

Not sure why you're being downvoted. There is documented evidence of this: > "To see this - traffic blocking the main intersection of a level 1 trauma centre, blocking the entrance and exit to our hospital. Blocking patients from receiving care that they need, makes me angry. It hurts. It hurts a lot," said one healthcare worker on Facebook. > WLNS reports another posting: "You are currently blocking ambulances, phys…

That first story is repeating a (false) rumor. Even the second story you posted directly contradicts it.

> Sparrow spokesperson John Foren said there are no access problems and ambulances can “get in and out. There’s no problem.”

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/0...

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#586

Post by Mouse47 »

colechristensen wrote: post #111

Some people say police attacking journalists are isolated incidents by a few bad eggs, most of them are doing the right thing. Some people say protestors becoming violent, vandalizing, and looting are isolated incidents by a few bad eggs, most of them are doing the right thing. Really similar thought processes go into those two, usually by people you can sort into camps of opposing worldviews. They're both right and…

One of these groups is capable of violating our right to free speech, our right to assemble, and our right to a trial by jury. The other is not.

No one is condoning looting - in fact, it's just as frustrating for me in that it's distracting from the message. But let's not forget what the (much, much) bigger problem is. I also believe that various bad-faith actors (police, conservatives) are using the looting to distract from the fact that the police have systematically deprived us of our rights with no recourse.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#588

Post by colejohnson66 »

evan_ wrote: post #306
ccvannorman wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If "the press" is the enemy of the people, who would be the right person/party to gather information and report news?

The insinuation is, TrumpTV

In all actuality, it’s probably Fox News. They’re one of the few remaining “big” newsrooms with a heavy conservative bias. Nothing wrong with that, but when people take what them and Trump say as doctrine, well, that’s a problem.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#589

Post by Auracle »

staticassertion wrote: post #383
Auracle wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I certainly don’t think the police cars in NYC going through those pedestrians - the first example on the page - is a good example. People crowded around the vehicles and starting throwing things at them. While I would expect police to have more restraint/less fear than they did, that wasn’t the police starting violence. I would expect almost anyone to have the same reaction they did. There was another NYC incident t…

Two different police vans drove up to a barricade and there were virtually no people behind them. Where do you think they were going? Why do you think they drove into the barrier to begin with? Why could they not back up?

The barricade was put by the protestors in front of them, and they were apparently responding to a call.

Yes, they should have backed up. My point is that they were attacked first, nothing else. It was kind of a play stupid games scenario - if you do that to someone chances are they’re going to freak out and at best be unpredictable.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#590

Post by lol2143651 »

mcv wrote: post #498
rpiguy wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because rioting isn’t free speech. All conservatives support peaceable assembly and protest. They also fiercely believe in property rights as inherently tied to the concept of liberty. It is right in the Declaration of Independence. No conservative worth his or her salt will defend theft, property destruction, etc.

Not at all. When Kaepernick protested in the most quiet, peaceful and respectful way possible, conservatives were screaming bloody murder. They also did that when MLK was leading protests. Conservatives support protests by white people, but never by black people.

Respectful? Most definitely not. He chose one of the most provocative ways he could.
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