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De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

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Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#21

Post by olliej »

SlavikCA wrote: post #11
olliej wrote: post #3

Yes, but police are functionally just wannabe soldiers, without the actual training. They want to beat people up. They want to be tough guys who have no consequences. Talking about how to fix policing means nothing until: * police go to jail * officers who do not report other officers go to jail * bosses/chiefs etc who are aware of abuses of power and brutality and do not arrest those officers go to jail * police are…

> all lawsuits are settled with funds from police pension funds I like it most. > police go to jail > officers who do not report other officers go to jail > bosses/chiefs etc who are aware of abuses of power and brutality and do not arrest those officers go to jail All these "go to jail" stops at the "qualified immunity". And no politician yet was willing to do anything about it. We need to demand to end this "qualif…

They can pay it from their own salary - officers who are subject to more claims will end up with higher costs.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#22

Post by dfee »

just_steve_h wrote: post #10

Folks - don't be obtuse. Police commanders know exactly what will happen when they escalate with tear gas and rubber bullets. Pro-police forces WANT mayhem. It makes people watching on TV afraid of the protests, and it changes the subject away from the widespread peaceful opposition to racist police violence.

Many people want mayhem, but I think your comment is wrong.

> Pro-police forces WANT mayhem ... it changes the subject away from the widespread peaceful opposition to racist police violence.

I don’t think that typical “pro-police forces” want to own the narrative of their cause being racist and violent.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#23

Post by rectang »

inputError wrote: post #7

ACAB

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.C.A.B.

This violates the site guidelines.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

> Please don't use Hacker News for political or ideological battle. That destroys the curiosity this site exists for.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#24

Post by matwood »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #12
coldcode wrote: post #4

Of course it does. But politicians who ramp up the rhetoric and threaten to have people killed does not. Flint and Camden and other cities where the police sat down or walked with the protestors have no issues. People connecting to people with understanding rarely results in violence. I think places where the police still walk a beat (or other regular outreach over a wide area) and get to know the locals rarely have…

There were reports of planned riots in rural Polk County. Knowing they didn't have the resources to cover wide spread area, the sheriff instructed citizens to shoot anyone who broke into their home. I support this. Telling citizens you can't help them, and they must protect themselves is very different than threatening that the state itself will kill you. https://twitter.com/FOX13News/status/1267539936401592320

Careful. That’s how Breonnna Taylor ended up dead.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#25

Post by nostromo »

just_steve_h wrote: post #10

Folks - don't be obtuse. Police commanders know exactly what will happen when they escalate with tear gas and rubber bullets. Pro-police forces WANT mayhem. It makes people watching on TV afraid of the protests, and it changes the subject away from the widespread peaceful opposition to racist police violence.

Minneapolis Chief of Police: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medaria_Arradondo

Seattle Chief of Police: http://www.seattle.gov/police/about-us/about-the-department/...

St Louis Chief of Police: http://www.slmpd.org/chief_of_police.shtml

Atlanta Chief of Police: https://www.projectq.us/atlanta/atlanta_police_chief_erika_s...

Chicago Chief of Police: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Brown_(police_officer)

Oakland Chief of Police: https://climaterwc.com/2019/07/17/san-mateo-police-chief-sus...

People on HN seem to have a cartoon villain view of police, so I thought I'd share a few faces of police leadership in effected communities.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#26

Post by michaelmior »

coldcode wrote: post #4

Of course it does. But politicians who ramp up the rhetoric and threaten to have people killed does not. Flint and Camden and other cities where the police sat down or walked with the protestors have no issues. People connecting to people with understanding rarely results in violence. I think places where the police still walk a beat (or other regular outreach over a wide area) and get to know the locals rarely have…

> But cities don't want to spend that kind of money on these things as they would rather not tax people to pay for it.

I'm certainly no expert in police budgeting, but when you see some police forces literally buying tanks, at least in some cases there must be room for money to be better spent. John Oliver did an interesting story on police militarization after the Ferguson riots following the shooting of Michael Brown.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUdHIatS36A

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#27

Post by somebrody »

dfee wrote: post #22
just_steve_h wrote: post #10

Folks - don't be obtuse. Police commanders know exactly what will happen when they escalate with tear gas and rubber bullets. Pro-police forces WANT mayhem. It makes people watching on TV afraid of the protests, and it changes the subject away from the widespread peaceful opposition to racist police violence.

Many people want mayhem, but I think your comment is wrong. > Pro-police forces WANT mayhem ... it changes the subject away from the widespread peaceful opposition to racist police violence. I don’t think that typical “pro-police forces” want to own the narrative of their cause being racist and violent.

> I don’t think that typical “pro-police forces” want to own the narrative of their cause being racist and violent

I think they do. Many cops seem to be very racist and very violent. It doesn't seem like they care who knows it. Even when they do care, they might not turn on body-cams which should be a fireable offense and now it finally is in at least one case in Kentucky.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#28

Post by arkades »

fasteddie31003 wrote: post #19

Imagine being a cop and having to deal with stuff like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8k4L97igDjY They literally save this man's life and he kills the guy who saved his life. Cops don't work in a safe space. Years of working in a violent and hateful environment must take a serious toll on them.

While there's a kernel of validity to what you're saying, cops in every state and every nation have to deal with a violent and hateful environment. The variation in outcomes suggests something else is at play.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#29

Post by somebrody »

nostromo wrote: post #25
just_steve_h wrote: post #10

Folks - don't be obtuse. Police commanders know exactly what will happen when they escalate with tear gas and rubber bullets. Pro-police forces WANT mayhem. It makes people watching on TV afraid of the protests, and it changes the subject away from the widespread peaceful opposition to racist police violence.

Minneapolis Chief of Police: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medaria_Arradondo Seattle Chief of Police: http://www.seattle.gov/police/about-us/about-the-department/... St Louis Chief of Police: http://www.slmpd.org/chief_of_police.shtml Atlanta Chief of Police: https://www.projectq.us/atlanta/atlanta_police_chief_erika_s... Chicago Chief of Police: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Brown_(police_officer) Oakland Chie…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking

Above, they cherry-picked a few cops that just happen to be the chief of police. It's not that simple.

You don't understand the institutions involved if you highlight these examples. Police, police unions, district attorneys, etc. It's not simple.

Re: De-Escalation Keeps Protesters and Police Safer

#30

Post by x86_64Ubuntu »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #12
coldcode wrote: post #4

Of course it does. But politicians who ramp up the rhetoric and threaten to have people killed does not. Flint and Camden and other cities where the police sat down or walked with the protestors have no issues. People connecting to people with understanding rarely results in violence. I think places where the police still walk a beat (or other regular outreach over a wide area) and get to know the locals rarely have…

There were reports of planned riots in rural Polk County. Knowing they didn't have the resources to cover wide spread area, the sheriff instructed citizens to shoot anyone who broke into their home. I support this. Telling citizens you can't help them, and they must protect themselves is very different than threatening that the state itself will kill you. https://twitter.com/FOX13News/status/1267539936401592320

You can shoot a home intruder during and outside of riot conditions. I'm not sure why he posted this.
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