Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation • Hacker News Board

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#21

Post by brenden2 » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:16 AM UTC

I keep hearing this from the mainstream, while at the same time politicians keep going on TV saying things that aren't true, or are misleading. I think the politicians are using tactics from the "how to stop riots" playbook, but they don't work in a world where information flows freely. Probably the best example of this is how the authorities in Minnesota lied about 80% of protestors being from out of state, and when someone went through the arrest records they found this was entirely false, and that in fact the vast majority were from MN, and most were locals[0].

They've been trying to use this tactic elsewhere (I've been hearing it from de Blasio and Cuomo), but I don't think it'll work anymore. Politicians don't want to acknowledge that the riots are the result of angry citizens acting out in the only way they have the power to act, which is through disorderly conduct, because the system doesn't work for them.

As I write this, I can hear concussion grenades going off outside my window (I live in the middle of Manhattan) for the 5th or 6th night in a row. Every night I've watched thousands of unarmed peaceful protestors march by, demanding action. Meanwhile the NYPD is out in full military gear firing chemical weapons and rubber bullets indiscriminately at anyone who looks at them the wrong way.

I guess my point is that the disinformation is coming from the officials too, so everyone needs to look hard at real evidence before jumping to any conclusions. Please don't fall for the appeal to authority fallacy.

[0]: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/minnesota-officials-say-most-pe...

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#22

Post by ilaksh » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:16 AM UTC

slimsag wrote: post #15

EDIT: removed my comment because it turns out I was very wrong apparently.. sorry

But it was true. They were protesting on Melrose and in Santa Monica in LA and also doing some looting and property damage, and on the news there was a black protestor saying that previously rioting had been occurred in black neighborhoods, but now they were deliberately targeting upscale white neighborhoods so they could not be ignored.

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#23

Post by yalogin » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:17 AM UTC

I myself have seen fake “tweet screenshots “ that are trying really hard to scare suburban people that antifa is attacking them that night and I am in a liberal circle for the most part. If that is the case I can only imagine how bad the situation is for people in rural areas.

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#24

Post by dicknuckle » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:17 AM UTC

jachee wrote: post #6

xupybd wrote: post #2

This could be very dangerous. If miss information leads to people distrusting the US government based on lies. But worse this could be a bad case of the boy crying wolf. Of the government does ever start taking these crazy authoritarian measures who will trust the information reporting it?

Isn't having a loose association of slightly-organized people who vehemently oppose fascism be declared as a "terrorist organization" already starting down the authoritarian path?

It's dangerous, even if it has no teeth.

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#25

Post by zebrafish » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:18 AM UTC

Any technical solutions to this that HN can think of? Twitter tracing traffic? Anomaly detection on tweet contents to find tweets from hacked accounts like the one in the article? Some sort of CA type model? I feel like this is a technical problem that could have a technical solution.

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#26

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:18 AM UTC

labster wrote: post #13

heymartinadams wrote: post #7

The single two greatest dangers to a happy life are (1) believing in falsehoods, and (2) spreading them.

Bokonon would disagree with you, and tell you to live by the foma[0] that make you happy and healthy and brave and strong. Don’t discount the right kinds of lies. [0]: harmless lies

[deleted]

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#27

Post by brenden2 » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:18 AM UTC

jachee wrote: post #11

I'm seeing false accusations of Antifa starting violence all over the place. It's the right-wing's boogieman-du-jours, and likely false-flag representation at best. Edit: Downvoters– tell me why you're downvoting this? Why would Antifa purposefully take actions that would deliberately cause an armed police response to otherwise-peaceful protests? Edit 2 since I can no longer post responses: Clearly the misinformation…

Unfortunately the mainstream has portrayed "antifa" as some kind of covert organization acting inappropriately. They fail to point out that antifa is literally short for anti-fascist. In other words, unless you're pro-fascism, you're anti-fascist by default. It's akin to calling yourself a liberal or conservative.

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#28

Post by user982 » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:19 AM UTC

White nationalist group posing as antifa called for violence on Twitter - https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/security/twitter-takes-down-was...

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#29

Post by nathcd » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:19 AM UTC

racnid wrote: post #3

Stop treating Twitter as news. It's trash, bots, and trashy bots all the way down.

I live in Minneapolis, and I'm not a Twitter user, but I've found that following news reporters on Twitter that are on-site has been the best way to get reliable information quickly during the protests. (I use nitter.net to follow them.) I don't even like Twitter, but I can say unequivocally that it's not "trash, bots, and trashy bots all the way down". It's been extremely valuable to me this week.

Re: Protests become fertile ground for online disinformation

#30

Post by schalab » Tue, Jun 02, 2020, 1:19 AM UTC

I have found if you have nothing constructive to do, then twitter sucks you in and is very addictive.

But after a few years or so of constant nonsense, you become adapted to the addiction and just ignore everything on it. Atleast thats what happened to me.

I went from constantly checking twitter to deleting my account and just going to the feed of one or two people once a day to keep informed.

I now laugh at how worked up everyone gets, and all the play acting and rival factions involved. Its almost like an iq test, where you pass if you dont play the game.

The problem is a lot of people are staying indoors right now with nothing to do and are discovering twitter/reddit for the first time.

Imagine a person not only new to social media, but new to the internet as a whole with no bs filters built in. He/she would be such a mark.

The real herd immunity is people understanding over time how emotionally manipulative social media is and learning to ignore it like we do 99% of advertisements.