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Google Is Not God of the Web

bilge.world

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Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#31

Post by [deleted] »

downerending wrote: post #16
kickscondor wrote: post #2

> There is a very reasonable argument for essential services like search engines and news websites to conform to/adopt standards like AMP, but for the rest of The Open Web, ingenuity and risktaking should be encouraged, not discouraged, for the true good of all Peoplekind. Hadn't really considered this - because minimalist page size is often such a given - but, for instance, many amateurs often don't know yet how to…

Actually, I'd be interested in an alternative web where ingenuity and risk-taking would be utterly forbidden. Just HTML, and a very basic subset at that. No Javascript at all, no CSS. So much of the web would be better and more universally usable without "modern" cruft.

[deleted]

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#32

Post by magicalist »

Not sure what this article is arguing.

Sometimes you want to make a slow website that doesn't fit well on a phone screen?

Leaving aside the fact that you can of course do that, and that if I'm using a search engine on my phone I probably (usually?) don't want to look at your slow site that I have to horizontally scroll...

> Modern web design principles are very rarely directed at regular people looking to make a website on something they are interested in. Instead, the focus is on creating websites that perform well:

> Don't use too many colours. Write short, catchy headlines. Don't let content be too long. Optimise for SEO. Produce video content, attention span is decreasing. Have a an obvious call to action. Push your newsletter. Keep important information above the fold. Don't make users think. Follow conventions.

All that's true to some extent if you're making a product on the web and you have a few seconds to hook a customer before they move on. If you're making a website for enthusiasts in some niche, though, content is your draw and you can worry less about some of these things.

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#33

Post by blueboo »

skilled wrote: post #14

Google Search is in a horrendous state right now. Search results have been getting worse each year, with interesting information being buried 20 pages down. I really hope they have plans to improve this or find an approach that works as a middle ground for generic SEO content.

This seems like a common claim here on HN. I would expect the creativity of the world's SEO hackers to outstrip any single team, so I expect you'rer right. But I struggle to find queries where interesting information isn't in the top handful of links.

[badgers in montana], [while loop python], [how to fix noisy refigerator], [nude stallman] all do just fine. Are there veins of queries that are particularly polluted? Even [homeopathy covid] is pretty good.

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#34

Post by verdverm »

thoraway1010 wrote: post #15
mhh__ wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What did Google ever do for us?

mhh___ types this while using chrome (open source) on android (open source), after reading their email in gmail and searching for the latest cat dancing videos on youtube. The sad reality most of the folks who claim never to use google or google never makes something available - almost always hot air. I do remember hotmail and MSN and AOL which preceded gmail, gmail was really pretty great when it came out. I think m…

I'm definitely a M$ convert (as a long time Linux user, first time Microsoft supporter)

They have changed tune and I now call them the biggest COSS company.

https://coss.media

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#35

Post by j-james »

downerending wrote: post #16
kickscondor wrote: post #2

> There is a very reasonable argument for essential services like search engines and news websites to conform to/adopt standards like AMP, but for the rest of The Open Web, ingenuity and risktaking should be encouraged, not discouraged, for the true good of all Peoplekind. Hadn't really considered this - because minimalist page size is often such a given - but, for instance, many amateurs often don't know yet how to…

Actually, I'd be interested in an alternative web where ingenuity and risk-taking would be utterly forbidden. Just HTML, and a very basic subset at that. No Javascript at all, no CSS. So much of the web would be better and more universally usable without "modern" cruft.

You could mess around with Gemini.

It's sort of like the Gopher protocol, but with links allowed in arbitrary locations.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23042424

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#36

Post by Covzire »

verdverm wrote: post #11
kickscondor wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My biggest problem with Google is that in the 2010s they began flagging sites that had too many links as "link farms" - this discouraged bloggers from posting blogrolls and killed many directories. This really damaged the Open Web that the author is talking about. You saw a widespread abandonment of blogs during 2011-2015. (People stopped seeing traffic to their blogs and just assumed blogs had died due to lack of in…

What about the people who abuse Google search to promote bad things? Should Google not adjust their algorithms to demote bad or harmful content. There are two sides of the coin. Is it really much different from the security cat and mouse game?

No, unless illegal.

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#37

Post by slantyyz »

skilled wrote: post #14

Google Search is in a horrendous state right now. Search results have been getting worse each year, with interesting information being buried 20 pages down. I really hope they have plans to improve this or find an approach that works as a middle ground for generic SEO content.

I don't know if it's a combination of overreliance on algorithmic rankings + seo or what, but if I search for something like "Panasonic GH5" (something I searched recently), I want to see the top two ranked items as the Panasonic product page, followed by the Wikipedia page.

When I run that search on Google in Canada, there is a Panasonic link on the first page (third link), but it's for the US store listing, which has less info on it than the normal product page.

But as you say, search is in a horrendous state. So is video discovery on Youtube. It seems like my front page recommendations on Youtube have turned to garbage in the last 12 months.

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#38

Post by franze »

tschellenbach wrote: post #10

It's funny that Google is so large, that one way to grow their business is to improve the user experience of the internet as a whole.

There is no way that anybody would see /amp as improving the user experience of the internet as a whole other than an "product management by KPI" dumbed down organization.

Re: Google Is Not God of the Web

#39

Post by verdverm »

youeseh wrote: post #27

God, how? Like, in the monotheistic sense or the polytheistic sense? If we're going poly, then Google is definitely one of the Gods of the web. Maybe even the top God, but there may be some competition there.

Please read first, the title is misleading.
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