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SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

nasa.gov

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Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#471

Post by aksss »

luckylion wrote: post #202
aksss wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not like Airbus’s hands are clean. https://ustr.gov/about-us/policy-offices/press-office/press-...

Are you suggesting that industrial espionage is okay if the targeted company is receiving subsidies from their government? I'm sure the Chinese will love that angle.

No, more indicating that both these companies receive so much patronage from their respective national defense agencies/industries and provide employment cover to their respective intelligence agencies that I’m not sure there’s a clean line between actions of them as private actor vs them as state actor. Doesn’t rationalize espionage or maybe it does, I don’t know. I just don’t think the set-up of Airbus, the innocent industrial, as victims of evil Boeing is a realistic implication. These are both behemoths tightly hooked to their national defense apparatus.

As for China, I think that angle is their acknowledged policy plus some.

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#472

Post by hyperdunc »

shoulderfake wrote: post #418
sakopov wrote: post #39

It's absolutely incredible to see this. So much work to get us here. So much work just to organize this launch event. Seeing astronauts getting dropped off in one of the most technologically advanced automobiles on Earth and walk into the capsule sitting on top of a rocket which is the Pinnacle of humanity's biggest advancements in technology and space is astounding and goosebumps-enducing. What a time to be alive!

I dont get it, wasnt this already accomplished? Whats the big deal ? The space station already exists, astronauts have gone there before.

The big deal is what is now much more likely to happen in 10 years because of what just happened. People are inspired by a successful mission and that makes the possibility of future missions more real.

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#473

Post by standardUser »

"American astronauts on American rockets from American soil on their way to the International Space Station, our national lab"

The ISS is not "our national lab". The hint is in the name.

Also, glad we got the very important reminder that this is happening in AMERICA

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#474

Post by ineedasername »

nabla9 wrote: post #415
Isinlor wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should listen to the astronauts. SpaceX is developing all of it with them and for them. They seem quite happy with UI because it allows rapid iteration on procedures. If they screw up something SpaceX can adjust interface within days. With space shuttle they would need to wait months and months.

Astronauts and pilots just talk PR to the public. "It's great, I'm so happy, we are all happy family. We had say on how these things work." Wait until they retire to find out the truth.

I mean, it's possible, but I'm skeptical of any argument here that assumes the astronauts would be willing to risk their lives using systems interfaces they believed would cost them precious time in a life & death situation. At least without more direct evidence than speculation that can't be disproved for upwards of a few decades.

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#475

Post by dleslie »

catalogia wrote: post #254
philwelch wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me the better precedent for Elon's eccentricities might be someone like Henry Ford. Ford was an undeniable genius and innovator in a way that inspired broad admiration, but he was also troublingly paternalistic with his workers--providing above-market pay and benefits but expecting them to live up to his moral standards in their personal lives. He was also a massive sponsor of anti-Semitic publications and, prior…

I think the comparison between Elon Musk and Henry Ford starts to break down a bit towards the end of your comment. Elon Musk tweets plenty I don't like, but he's far from a Nazi.

This is definitely a hindsight is 20/20 moment.

In an age where radio was new, where televisions were even newer, where transcontinental news took hours, days or even weeks to travel, the knowledge that the Nazis were engaging in mass murder was not readily available.

When allied troops liberated the concentration camps they filmed everything that they saw because they were concerned that without footage no one would believe them. Why? Because it was a shock, a shock so unbelievable in writing that only video and photographic evidence would suffice.

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#476

Post by rtpg »

jp_sc wrote: post #277
sandworm101 wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> into orbit in a spacecraft that was designed from the ground up to be a commercial venture. If we are talking pure commercial travel, it is a vehicle without a destination. The ISS is definitely not a commercial project. There are lots of reasons for the ISS to exist, and they have changed over time, but it has never been a money-making venture. While the dragons certainly do come in under budget, they are a more…

- International travel (anywhere in the world in less than two hours) could be one of those things. - Asteroid mining

Plus queueing plus landing etc? At a price way more than a private jet or some Concorde like thing? In low comfort?

The dynamic simply isn’t there

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#477

Post by scarygliders »

runarberg wrote: post #315
TeMPOraL wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a fair point. Hell, I'd argue that half the interest in spaceflight (except those of people seeing it all through the lens of an Excel sheet) is because of the idea of sending people up there. That alone makes an occasional manned mission worth it, just to keep the general interest alive.

It is not the 1910s any more. We don’t risk other peoples lives on exploration. Heroic though it might seem, it is ultimately foolish. We are already exploring the solar system with machines. And there is no reason to risk the explorers life for a more limited and more expensive ways to explore.

Exploration is timeless.

"Let's see what's out there!"

It's human nature.

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#478

Post by rtpg »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #320
zitterbewegung wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people are floating the idea that eventually we would either have commercial companies adding a "space hotel" to the ISS for testing purposes and when the ISS is retired that the hotel would continue to exist. Once you have companies either vying for real estate in orbit the demand for people to visit the hotel could eventually spur demand for other places to go.

I would be astounded if there were no space hotel projects shopping around for finance already. Although I think given the likely customer profile we're at least as likely to get Vegas-in-Orbit - casinos, hookers and all - as labs and exploration.

The minuscule ISS is already the most expensive structure ever built. What universe has something like described being economical?

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#479

Post by krapp »

scarygliders wrote: post #477
runarberg wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not the 1910s any more. We don’t risk other peoples lives on exploration. Heroic though it might seem, it is ultimately foolish. We are already exploring the solar system with machines. And there is no reason to risk the explorers life for a more limited and more expensive ways to explore.

Exploration is timeless. "Let's see what's out there!" It's human nature.

We already know what's out there, we have telescopes and probes. We're not going to find jungles on Venus or something like that. We're not going to meet the Vulcans.

Re: SpaceX successfully launches two humans into orbit

#480

Post by cm2012 »

nickik wrote: post #439
aeturnum wrote: post #205

How wonderful! Congratulations to the entire Space X team, this is a real accomplishment and I'm sure not one that came easily. It's exciting to see relatively small companies fulfilling roles that people thought might require massive military contractors. Elon is an interesting figure. He is, I think, a paradigmatic example of the imperfect creator. His undeniable success in difficult endeavors can create an aura of…

You can hate Elon if you want or think whatever, but anybody that can't admit that on purely intelligence level he is genius is pretty much in denial.

He's smart but not infallible. He said covid would be at zero cases by April.
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