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Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

nytimes.com

41–50 of 73 posts

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#41
post #38
post #26

How many people in the world are actually qualified to offer any useful help on the Japan nuclear situation? Does anyone really think that they're just sitting around doing nothing right now? I don't care how organized and prepared the Japanese are - they need help right now. Even before the disaster, they relied on imports for food and fuel. Large portions of their economy are now offline, and hundreds of thousands…

Please don't send any Real American Heroes to Tokyo. We're fine. Send them up north where they're needed.

I think you missed my point.

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#42
The thing I don't get about Patrick's opinion is that in his initial write-up he compares his personal danger and proximity to the disaster zone with "someone ringing up Mayor Daley [the mayor of Chicago] during Katrina and saying “My God man, that’s terrible — how are you coping?”"

Well, if his argument was that distance separates him from being able to relate to the problems on the ground, why should anybody look to him for guidance on how to provide aid?

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#43
My consolidated response:

1) Shortages in Fukushima, etc, are not caused by lack of food or money. Japan has plenty of food and money. Japan has a temporary logistics problem with getting food to particular refugee sites, because of a number of issues, most critically that the infrastructure for delivering gas in the east got a severe monkey-wrench thrown into it and it is difficult to truck in enough to do distribution. With specific reference to Fukushima, the widening of the exclusion zone caused refugees to have to be moved twice is as many days, which also caused some issues.

The three closest ports for receiving refined gas got shut down by the tsunami (along with most local refinery capacity), so it has been getting transported by road from the other side of the country, and that has been hampered by damage to certain roads. One of those ports will be brought online today. As that situation gets better, the shortage of supplies for refugees will ease very rapidly. They're working very hard on that right now. Aid will not speed that process: any charity chosen at random is not better at doing gas delivery than Japanese gas companies, and no part of the relief efforts is blocking on lack of money.

2) Panic is not helping anyone, and foreign panic is feedback looping right now, particularly in the foreign communities. The only reason I have talked to the media at all is to stress the importance of them not panicking and not provoking panic.

3) I respect enormously people's desire to help, but satisfying desire to help is a very different thing from actually helping. The second is very important, the first not so much.

I was on a program on the BBC the other day. Another guest was a foreign aid worker from an organization I will not name. Host: "Where are you?" Him: "Not quite sure, north of Tokyo. The map is in Japanese." When asked about their plans for doing counseling, he said that they would find somebody locally who speaks English, because in his experience at X disasters across the world there is always somebody, and do counseling through the interpreter. One could be forgiven for difficulty in finding the value of his organization's assistance at the moment.

The US military's response has been invaluable -- choppers are very helpful right now, and have been saving lives. If you don't come packing your own distribution network designed to function parallel to the civilian ones, your ability to convert any amount of desire into hot meals at a school in eastern Japan is very limited right now.

After the immediate situation is addressed, Miyagi, Iwate, and the like will have large reconstruction efforts. Japan has the political will and resources to handle this.

A note: It is a very fluid situation. My blog post was written on Sunday, 3.5 days ago. The NYT asked me for a condensed version 2.5 days ago. Please keep in mind, when you're hearing from anybody (including me), you're hearing something which was true X amount of time ago in a situation evolving very rapidly.

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#44
post #43

My consolidated response: 1) Shortages in Fukushima, etc, are not caused by lack of food or money. Japan has plenty of food and money. Japan has a temporary logistics problem with getting food to particular refugee sites, because of a number of issues, most critically that the infrastructure for delivering gas in the east got a severe monkey-wrench thrown into it and it is difficult to truck in enough to do distribut…

Thank you for the unbelievably sane perspective on disaster relief.

For anyone that is motivated to give charitable dollars by this disaster, consider that there is likely a more efficient charity as far as maximizing lives saved per dollar, such as Village Reach. http://www.givewell.org/international/top-charities/villager...

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#45
post #40
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Japan is the third largest economy in the world. Uganda and Cambodia don't even make it into the top hundred. Most of those 'development dollars' never even make their way remotely close to the people in third-world countries; the graft and corruption sees to that. I live in Tokyo, and it's pretty insulting to hear this kind of shit. Japan can certainly use the short-term help, especially from trained rescue workers,…

This is like saying that people in New Orleans didn't need help after Katrina just because I lived nowhere near Louisiana. Don't take your frustration at 'the West' for thinking that people in Tokyo are as hard hit as the areas to the north out on others. Just because life goes on in Tokyo does not mean that there is no crisis to the north. Your entire post comes across to me as high arrogance. If by Shinto-buddhism,…

I get the feeling that he's moreso responding to the fact that, in this situation, you can't compare the likes of Japan and Cambodia.

Hell, swap Japan for the US - doesn't make so much sense now, does it? It is an incredibly off putting thing to find people thinking that Tokyo is on fire and about to keel over because of what's going on up north, and while I agree with him on that front, I still agree with the parent commenter here about donating somewhere.

In reality, this is all pretty blatantly obvious stuff.

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#46
post #37
post #4

First comment in the article is disturbing: One of my wife's relatives is working with those made homeless in her hometown of Ofunato, Iwate Prefecture, which was destroyed by the tsunami. She and many other workers along the coast would not agree with your assessment. The Western media have made the Fukushima nuclear plant the most salient aspect of this tragedy, not least because of the politics and economics of th…

This. This this this. You know who's fleeing the 'impending nuclear holocaust'? The foreigners who get all of their news from English-language media. One of my coworkers flew back to NYC because he was so worried about radiation exposure. You get exposed to more radiation by taking a twelve-hour flight than you would by camping in a pup tent in the mountains overlooking the reactor complex. The Japanese news is full…

I think the main point of the comment bad_user quoted is not the same you're making here.

That said, I do feel that the Japanese Tokyoites are calmer about the nuclear thing. Anecdotally, more than half of my foreign friends and acquaintances have fled or are planning to flee Tokyo (mostly to elsewhere in Japan, some abroad), but nearly all my Japanese friends have stay put.

It's not all about the news, though. While I share your perception that English-language media is being way more sensationalist about it, it's not the case that all my foreign friends get all their news from English-language media. Some of them speak Japanese, and some have Japanese spouses, but are still fleeing. Other possible factors: foreigners have less roots here, have more options to flee, and more incentive to leave (family is abroad, etc). So the total perceived "cost" to flee is lower.

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#47
post #46
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. This this this. You know who's fleeing the 'impending nuclear holocaust'? The foreigners who get all of their news from English-language media. One of my coworkers flew back to NYC because he was so worried about radiation exposure. You get exposed to more radiation by taking a twelve-hour flight than you would by camping in a pup tent in the mountains overlooking the reactor complex. The Japanese news is full…

I think the main point of the comment bad_user quoted is not the same you're making here. That said, I do feel that the Japanese Tokyoites are calmer about the nuclear thing. Anecdotally, more than half of my foreign friends and acquaintances have fled or are planning to flee Tokyo (mostly to elsewhere in Japan, some abroad), but nearly all my Japanese friends have stay put. It's not all about the news, though. While…

I think what irritates me about the people booking it out of Tokyo is that (a) it helps to panic other people; and, (b) fuel and electricity are on the short side right now.

Long rail journeys and trans-ocean flights don't help conserve either of these.

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#48
post #8

I'm starting to get feed up about patio11 and the all's well attitude and "we'll manage, thank you very much". The last head-count is seventeen thousand dead and rising. It is obvious that all is _not_ well and that people in the affected areas need help and fast.

This.

No offense Patrick, you're a great dude, but I'm somewhat put off by that attitude. It's easy to say when you are in Nagoya; do you guys even have the electricity problem in the 60hz zone of Japan?

To clarify, I am still in Tokyo, working in Yokohama at the moment, and I don't think Tokyo has a problem. (I am worried about _long term_ exposure to elevated radiation, but that is neither here nor there.) I do think the foreign media has been blowing things out of proportion (to the point where I told my mom I had relocated to Yamanashi to calm her down).

However, these irritatingly smug articles about how everything is "alright", and not to "panic" are ridiculous. I keep getting such sanctimonious messages on my Twitter feed about how nothing's wrong; I suspect quite a few are infowar soundbytes meant for American consumption. With a lack of clear, trustworthy information, it is entirely logical to assume the worst and ride out the tide while waiting for objective sources of information (geiger counters, etc..) to prove things one way or another.

I "panicked" and bought 15 kilos of rice, canned foods and lentils. (Not to mention batteries, etc..) I filled up my bathtub with water, and stored as much as I could in safe places. (I also did it before the powerplants blew.) Most likely nothing will happen and I won't have to do food shopping for another 3-6 months. However, in the odd chance that things really do go south (another earthquake, etc...), I have an improved chance of getting out alive.

I don't begrudge anyone for feeling that there is more than meets the eye at play, and for leaving. Seeing the "macho posing" on twitter and facebook is stupid; no one is more masculine because you are still here. (I'm here, but only because my company stupidly decided to keep working when its entire staff is demoralized. BTW, if anyone wants a Python/Django engineer and project manager with a B.Sc, I'm willing to relocate. ;) )

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#49
post #2

At your discretion, how did you land this Patrick? Perhaps this can be better answered on your blog, but did the NYT contact you after coming across your article? Original article submission: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2319629

I didn't "land" this -- I didn't seek it and don't particularly want it. Folks in the media in several English-speaking countries abroad have been contacting me repeatedly for the last couple of days, and when contacted I try to say "Yes, I would be happy to do that" with the goal of improving the reporting available in English and averting panic.

As to why I'm suddenly several reporters go-to guy for this? The biggest reason is that I speak English and am accessible. They know about me because my blog post on Sunday got widely distributed abroad. (I suspect many of them follow Jimmy Wales, who retweeted it.) My blog has working contact information on it. Also, since the media are pack animals, as soon as anybody quoted me then I was a Certified Expert (TM) and so everybody else should quote me, too.

They really should be talking with the guy I talked about in my blog post who actually pushed the button to turn on the warning system at our clients out east. (Someone at the company found I had mentioned them and passed the word around. He sent me a message saying that reading it gave him hope and pride in trying circumstances. I would trade a hundred thousand angry emails from people for that.) Or they could talk to any city office in Japan and ask "So, what is SOP for this sort of thing?"

Either of those would be better choices than me. But, again, they don't speak English and they're not in reporters' Rolodexes. Through a quirk set of circumstances, I am. So when they call and ask "How much should we be panicking?" I say "Don't panic." (A radio station wanted my opinion on the likelihood of them getting poisoned by radioactivity from Fukushima half a globe away. I'm not a nuclear engineer. Of course I immediately said "I am not a nuclear engineer, but to put your listeners at ease, that will not happen." It's the right answer. It probably shouldn't be coming from me, but someone should say it, loudly.)

Re: Patrick McKenzie (patio11) on Japan Aid: Help for the Well-Prepared

#50
What bothers me is that so many people say everything is fine. How do we know? The people in charge have left the building !

"Its under control" means someone is actually controlling it. However if everyone has left the plant it can't be under human control!

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