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The Day AppGet Died

keivan.io

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Re: The Day AppGet Died

#211

Post by cwojno »

kayone wrote: post #80

Author here, Because it's sure to come up here is a comment I wrote on Reddit that clarifies somethings, I haven't updated the original article since I'm not sure what the etiquette for updating a highly shared article is. ------ Code being copied isn't an issue. I knew full well what it meant to release something opensource and I don't regret it one bit. What was copied with no credit is the foundation of the projec…

Not only should they say you're the inventor, but they should have paid you for it. They snowballed you. Microsoft doesn't deserve you

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#212

Post by hnick »

chii wrote: post #168
hnick wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If my web server calls out to AGPL software (such as executing a transform on a PDF using Ghostscript) as an external binary is this covered even though the AGPL code is not directly compiled, linked or modified? I'd assume so otherwise it would be a very easy loophole and code could be firewalled into separate modules but I'm not sure what exact language covers this in the license.

It's untested in court. GCC is written specifically to prevent this sort of firewalling of the compiler to prevent it from being plugged into another piece of software and avoid GPL requirements.

Good to know, it'll be interesting if it ever does get tested.

Even then there's always the analogue/human loophole I suppose, similar to captcha mechanical turks.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#213

Post by throwaway2048 »

wvenable wrote: post #186
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's a failure of the NT subsystem approach, I think that's just that Linux turned out to have a massive and changing ABI surface and Microsoft didn't want to try and recreate the whole thing by clean room reimplementation. Yes, there were some difficulties because of different underlying primitives, but in my outsider's opinion, they could have made it work if they've been wanting to spend the time a…

The problem they couldn't solve is file system performance -- there's just too much of difference conceptually between files in Windows and files in Linux to make it perform reasonably well for the sorts of jobs people were using. In the end, it just makes more sense to pull in the actual Linux kernel than to try and achieve the same performance semantics.

Windows file system performance in general is abysmally bad, we are talking Linux being 10x-100x faster on mass operations on small files for instance.

Due to this lots of Linux stuff is based around huge masses of tiny files (build processes, VCS, docker, etc) and there was just no chance the windows kernel was ever going to come remotely close performance wise.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#214

Post by defnotashton2 »

jjeaff wrote: post #210
ryandrake wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Honestly somewhat insulting that they made him go through a full external interview loop. Wait, what? So if someone is a "name brand" celebrity, they should get to jump the queue and coast by with an "informal chat?" How is that fair? I don't care if I'm interviewing John Carmack, he's getting the same evaluation process I would give to any other senior candidate. Software Engineering's got enough problems with int…

I find it unlikely that even large companies put their superstar famous hires through the same hiring process.

They don't for sure given a certain point. It is known. Have you ever heard of a formal interview process for execs.. No.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#215

Post by throwaway2048 »

Conan_Kudo wrote: post #184
tuesday20 wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, they’re getting bad PR now for screwing the author over ...

No, they're not. That's the point . The problem is that nobody cares outside of here. If it shows up on a prominent Windows news site/blog, then I would consider it a PR disaster. But that hasn't yet happened.

Bit early to call that one.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#216

Post by throwaway2048 »

person_of_color wrote: post #123
kayone wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really doubt it was it. Sonarr was one of the topics we talked about during the first meeting at Microsoft Vancouver. Even if that was the case, I have no regrets.

I would say engineers have a different perspective than upper management.

You are making a total shot in the dark guess

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#217

Post by SeeTheTruth »

bluGill wrote: post #6
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know the details of your project, but what if you open sourced under the GPL? I feels as though the world has soured on the GPL in recent years, but whenever I see this type of sentiment—that open sourcing work is just a gift from small developers to big tech companies, or something thereabouts—I think, wouldn't the GPL solve that problem? Sure, big companies can still use GPL'd code, but they're forced to gi…

Big companies are more likely to give back to non gpl code in my experience. The gpl scares them enough that when they use it they isolate it carefully so they don't have to make changes. Non gpl code (depending on license terms of course) get embedded where it is easier to need changes and then a desire to keep up with some other feature means they contribute back. Of course either way they are a business and will b…

So it's not worth it. Why be less careful than companies in the hope they will be good citizens, when it's easier to be careful and not have to hope?

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#218

Post by throwaway2048 »

jpalomaki wrote: post #197
ryan29 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm convinced the sole purpose of some open source projects are to be good enough to prevent other open source projects from filling the void, but bad enough to keep from competing with vested commercial interests. This might just be one of those cases. Why would Microsoft want to invest in another distribution platform when they already have the Microsoft Store where they can do whatever they want? Sure, WinGet has…

Microsoft is likely looking for a solution that would allow easy distribution of software in enterprise context without having to repackage it. Having a widely accepted and used package format would solve that. You could just pick the package for notepad++ and others and push them to workstations via Intune.

They already have MSI though?

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#219

Post by [deleted] »

throwaway2048 wrote: post #213
wvenable wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem they couldn't solve is file system performance -- there's just too much of difference conceptually between files in Windows and files in Linux to make it perform reasonably well for the sorts of jobs people were using. In the end, it just makes more sense to pull in the actual Linux kernel than to try and achieve the same performance semantics.

Windows file system performance in general is abysmally bad, we are talking Linux being 10x-100x faster on mass operations on small files for instance. Due to this lots of Linux stuff is based around huge masses of tiny files (build processes, VCS, docker, etc) and there was just no chance the windows kernel was ever going to come remotely close performance wise.

[deleted]

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#220

Post by moron4hire »

a-nikolaev wrote: post #112
alpb wrote: post #91

There are parts of Microsoft that understand open source. Most parts of the Windows team ain’t that (exceptions apply). Reading this saddens me a lot as he clearly got screwed. But this is why any project with momentum should consider growing its community and maybe forming a foundation. For example, Homebrew and its community/infrastructure is better than and bigger than anything Apple could ever do (and we know how…

Not everyone is able or willing to develop large-scale open-source community/project.. Also, mono is a much large and more significant project that runs on Linux, not a Windows app.

Mono also runs on Windows
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