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Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

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Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#751

Post by m0zg »

Traster wrote: post #36

I think this is going to be a discussion thread that is almost inevitably going to be a shitshow, but anyway: There are people who advocate the idea that private companies should be compelled to distribute hate speech, dangerously factually incorrect information and harassment under the concept that free speech is should be applied universally rather than just to government. I don't agree, I think it's a vast over-re…

This right here gentleman is in charge of what Twitter deems "factually correct" and "safe" for you: https://twitter.com/yoyoel/status/796186371408789505

Just wonderful, absolutely unbiased human being, 100% "site integrity" guaranteed: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8361349/Head-Twitte...

So no, let's not "lay that aside".

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#752

Post by legolas2412 »

kitd wrote: post #605
0x5002 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have struggled with both points of the argument for a while now. In general, I'm inclined to agree with your assessment that this would be a glaring overreach on the side of the feds. It's also apparent that social networks have a tendency to cater massively to one side of the increasingly divided political spectrum, as proven with experiments like Gab. I've always liked the idea of having a Twitter clone that base…

FWIW, the BBC World Service podcast "The Compass" [1] has an excellent series on free speech by the veteran BBC journalist Robin Lustig. I highly recommend it. He covers tech companies, universities, blasphemy laws, etc. [1] - https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p035w97h/episodes/downloads For me, free speech is fundamentally about trying to rectify the injustice of an imbalance of power between those in authority and t…

> If these companies want us to take them seriously as champions of free speech, they have to play their role to help restore that balance of power, by being far more stringent about fact-checking the tweets of those global leaders than they would be for ordinary posters.

What about the executive and majority stockowners of these companies, and how they might abuse their power?

I would rather prefer a federated structure like email. Anybody can choose their own clients to generate their own biased/unbiased feeds, and with plugins for fact checking.

Elizabeth Warren had a position on making the big tech companies open platforms. That was along the same lines, and would provide a far better solution than handing off the power to control people off to FB and Twitter execs

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#753

Post by defen »

tootie wrote: post #701
centimeter wrote: post #676

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the actual conservative pain point is that they (correctly) observe that freedom of association (i.e. businesses get to choose their customers) only seems to apply when it benefits progressives - contrast Google evicting milquetoast conservatives from Youtube with no legal repercussions versus that baker in Colorado getting sued a bunch of times for not wanting to bake gay, satanist, etc. themed cakes. There…

There's ample for why it's illegal to discriminate against classes of people. Imagine business in the 20s with signs saying "Irish need not apply" or "No dogs or Jews". The recent case with the baker was extending the protection of human rights to gay couples. Any "conservative" content that has been kicked off of platforms like YouTube has been specifically targeted not for political reasons but because they were sp…

> The recent case with the baker was extending the protection of human rights to gay couples.

He offered to sell them a pre-made cake (in compliance with non-discrimination laws). The question was whether he could be compelled to perform an act of speech (custom-making a cake) that violated his sincerely-held religious beliefs.

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#754

Post by fixmycode »

tossAfterUsing wrote: post #733
standardUser wrote: post #652

There seem to be some upside down priorities here. Many folks seem to be arguing that its an unacceptable form of censorship for a private platform to annotate content it allows others to post. Meanwhile, I'm seeing barely a mention of the fact that the President of the United States has threatened to use government power to shut down an entire sector of the economy devoted to communication. The latter is almost cert…

Mhm. Also missing from the parts of the discussion i've yet read, is the question of what sort of software we're using. At the risk of using a buzzword, decentralized comms could reduce the risks of constitutional shutdown. And maybe even be better.

I hope they name it mastodon.gov

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#755

Post by Consultant32452 »

Trump stated an opinion about what he personally believes will happen if mail-in ballot use is expanded. He might be incorrect, but Twitter singling this out to promote opposing opinions is by no means "fact checking."

This is a campaign contribution with a real economic value that should be calculable. So let's just let the FEC figure out the value of this contribution and all of the existing regulations will apply.

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#756

Post by fareesh »

The existence of such a diversity of views on whether or not the statement was factual or not factual is enough of a good reason to see why this feature is not a good idea.

The discussion being had between diverse perspectives is not helped when the platform starts flagging things with its own hand-picked opinion.

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#757

Post by kube-system »

centimeter wrote: post #676
Traster wrote: post #36

I think this is going to be a discussion thread that is almost inevitably going to be a shitshow, but anyway: There are people who advocate the idea that private companies should be compelled to distribute hate speech, dangerously factually incorrect information and harassment under the concept that free speech is should be applied universally rather than just to government. I don't agree, I think it's a vast over-re…

I think the actual conservative pain point is that they (correctly) observe that freedom of association (i.e. businesses get to choose their customers) only seems to apply when it benefits progressives - contrast Google evicting milquetoast conservatives from Youtube with no legal repercussions versus that baker in Colorado getting sued a bunch of times for not wanting to bake gay, satanist, etc. themed cakes. There…

> they (correctly) observe that freedom of association (i.e. businesses get to choose their customers) only seems to apply when it benefits progressives

This can be mostly likely summed up as self-selection bias. Discrimination laws are not being applied unequally to people of differing political opinions. It is much more common that people's political identities are self-chosen based on their own personal identity and experiences.

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#758

Post by bosswipe »

0x5002 wrote: post #94
Traster wrote: post #36

I think this is going to be a discussion thread that is almost inevitably going to be a shitshow, but anyway: There are people who advocate the idea that private companies should be compelled to distribute hate speech, dangerously factually incorrect information and harassment under the concept that free speech is should be applied universally rather than just to government. I don't agree, I think it's a vast over-re…

I have struggled with both points of the argument for a while now. In general, I'm inclined to agree with your assessment that this would be a glaring overreach on the side of the feds. It's also apparent that social networks have a tendency to cater massively to one side of the increasingly divided political spectrum, as proven with experiments like Gab. I've always liked the idea of having a Twitter clone that base…

Yoel Roth who? Oh, after some googling it looks like Fox News has picked the target for the latest Two Minutes Hate.

Re: Trump threatens to 'close' down social media platforms

#759

Post by Avicebron »

mullingitover wrote: post #721
centimeter wrote: post #676

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the actual conservative pain point is that they (correctly) observe that freedom of association (i.e. businesses get to choose their customers) only seems to apply when it benefits progressives - contrast Google evicting milquetoast conservatives from Youtube with no legal repercussions versus that baker in Colorado getting sued a bunch of times for not wanting to bake gay, satanist, etc. themed cakes. There…

[flagged]

But who get's to arbiter the content of one's character? And by what metrics are so perfect they won't be abused or change in 5 years?
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