121–130 of 469 posts
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This is proving not to be an issue in Sweden or any of the places that have already opened up their economies. Flattening the curve was a myth potentially.
The very high death rate in Sweden suggests otherwise.
Not sure why you're giving incomplete and somewhat sensational fear inducing information.
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If you compare Sweden to other countries with full and absolute total lockdowns like Belgium the UK and Spain and Italy....they actually have lower incidences of infections fatalities and higher incidences of recoveries. Sweden is the control group in all of this for how effective lockdowns are and it's showing that they're potentially not as effective as we think they are.
You can't compare Sweden to those countries. Not the same density, not the same hubs, not hit at the same time, not the same social comportments. Even compared to France they have advantages and they have pretty close numbers (+30% excess death vs + 33%).
How do the other data points apply to a country that's been on quarantine for months and another that has never been on quarantine?
The exponential explosion of coronavirus cases hasn't happened in Sweden and it's not happening so far when people reopen their economies. there's not even a second wave in economies that have been reopened since early May like Florida.
The model was flawed.
Time to face facts quarantine was ineffective response.
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I think this is an unfair characterization and borderline misinformation. Medication can be net positive given severe symptoms. Every person is different, and medication for psychological issues should not be a first line of defense, but it can be helpful and potentially life saving. When you make a blanket statement like “medication will turn you into a zombie”, not only are you wrong, but you could be turning peopl…
I qualified that statement with "most of", and if anything comments like yours promote laissez faire attitude towards pharmaceuticals, the consequences of which are disastrous - as can be seen by the opioid epidemic etc. Look, drugs work. They work incredibly well for some people. You absolutely should avoid them if you can help it. Makes sense, no?
The issue is knowing whether you can "tough it out". Will you make it through without medication? Will you make it through in a reasonable time frame?
It's a valid point, but I don't think it's a good idea to judge that for yourself. It's very similar to anti-biotics. It's a good idea to avoid them in general and not take them when you don't need to or when they won't do anything. But it's a terrible idea to want to make that call if you don't have the training. And it's a bad idea to figure "ah, I'm better, I'll just drop these now" after a day or two.
I personally believe that the "zombie-like state" is blown out of proportion, and I'm certain that even with side-effects, anti-depressants are still much nicer than going through a major depressive episode.
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Your qualifier “most of” makes little difference. It’s wrong and you couldn’t possibly know that anyway. I don’t care to share my own personal anecdotes about my experiences with various psychotropic medications but I will say that being a “zombie” has seldom been a side effect of them. Bringing up opiates in a thread about psychiatric medication is either a deliberate red herring or a clear indicator of your ignoran…
You agree pharmaceuticals should be administered judiciously and yet find the energy to disagree on... what exactly? Throwing around terms like "misinformation" in an attempt to discredit what amounts to essentially a common sense conclusion is baffling and borders on vitriol. If you have personal history with mental disorders and anti-depressants, I in no way mean to diminish your experience, and hope things turn ou…
There are problems with statements like that:
1. Turns away people who might otherwise have no better treatment option ("What's the point of living if I'll just be a zombie anyway?")
2. It comes off as judgmental which has an isolating effect to people who are on the treatment. Hearing something like this could lead a person to question their sanity when they'd otherwise be okay (aka triggering, maybe you triggered me!)
3. It's just wrong.
Antidepressant drugs generally don't turn people into zombies at commonly-prescribed therapeutic doses. At very high doses they can have an emotionally blunting effect and even this is preferable in some cases. There are side effects and no one would argue that it's ideal to be on these drugs, I totally agree with you on that, but there are worse things than being on a drug.
I think you just have to be really careful when you throw blanket statements around on these topics because the people they can influence are not feeling their best and at much higher risk for suicide than people who wouldn't care because they wouldn't need drug treatment anyway. Personally I hope to never deal with antidepressants again, but in the past they've helped me get through times when I felt otherwise out of options. And somehow I escaped turning into a zombie :)
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Playing devil's advocate, how are we sure excess deaths are due to covid and not the lockdowns instead? (Suicides, cancelled surgeries, etc.)
Ok, playing systems-engineer here: we'd call those secondary COVID-19 deaths caused by the either de facto or de jure lock-downs. Why, oh why, are some people so obsessed with lowering the number of COVID-19 related deaths at every possible opportunity? Its weird.
Maybe they want to minimize the amount of secondary COVID-19 deaths?
I've dealt with depression and anxiety for many years. I just want to tell anyone who happens to read this: it's ok to ask for help, it's ok to go to therapy, it's ok to use antidepressants. Find the tools that work for you and keep asking for help when you need it. (Believe me, I know how hard it is.)
I would caution against using any sort of chemicals, try to exhaust all other options first. You don't want the sort of problem where you feel unlike your own self without some substance, not to mention that most of them basically reduce you to a zombie. Sleepwalking through life isn't my idea of living.
I went way too long before trying an antidepressant because I was worried I'd lose who I was, that I'd face social stigma, and that I was somehow cheating.
Turns out they've made me more expressive, energetic, and connected to others in my life. The biggest effect is an increased ability to break out of mental ruts much more easily.
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It's worth looking into make support groups. There's various movements starting up support groups for men run by men, who are trying to break that stigma. I don't know where you are based but have a Google and you may find a local one.
Funny enough, I looked at my local meetups and the biggest one is run by a woman. It's probably a good idea anyway.
While, anything is probably better than nothing, I've found that it's crucial to find a therapist that one 'clicks' with. I wasted quite a bit of time sticking with a therapist who didn't help (and possibly made things worse, much as she meant well).
If a therapist is not an option, I also recommend support groups. In some ways those have been even /more/ of a help than a therapist, because the fact that they're not paid does matter, and the fact that it's a solution without an end-date comforted me.
As a thirty-something, 1) I wish that I looked for help earlier, and 2) I would do everything in my power to move to a different place if I couldn't find the support wherever I was. It's been /that/ helpful.
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I'm always ignored when I ask for help. Being a person who "takes it like a man" in a sense, as in absorbs these problems for greater overall execution, I'm always ignored when I bring up my problems. "Tough shit" is the general attitude. Unless I'm highly expressive or emotional nobody takes it seriously. But if I'm being that emotional it's already too late.
I have the same issue for physical problems. I don't like to complain and I'm not really expressive. Physical appearance may also play a role (I'm 1.95m/95kg.) I had a double hernia with sciatic nerve inflammation go undiagnosed for quite some time before I took my wife with me to the doc and she complained in my stead. In any case, I've been postponing going to a psychologist for exactly this reason: I'm convinced I…
I wonder what's the correlation between this and people being underpaid. I'm fortunate enough to have my own house after graduation so I don't have to pay rent. But I have friends that don't have this luxury and man, they are struggling. Besides eating and rent they can't afford anything else in a month. No question here what's giving them these feelings
The U.S. is an extremely backwards country when it comes to taking care of its people, with city streets literally lined up with tents of homeless people in some of its biggest cities. No universal healthcare, low social mobility, it's not the least bit surprising to me that a third of the country is depressed. It's just sad that our government does nothing about it while our president is busy tweeting conspiracy theories.