Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

news.ycombinator.com

31–40 of 57 posts

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#31
No. At least not through the normal application process. I have worked with many brilliant Indian people, and some of my favorite colleagues were Indian. However, there is so much "noise" in India's talent pool [1] - bad communication, fake degrees, fake profiles, sloppy work - that it just takes too much effort filtering through it. I understand that it's biased, but simply not hiring from India seems to be the better business decision when there is good talent elsewhere.

Of course, the exception are people that come through the network, not through a "normal" application process.

[1] https://restofworld.org/2020/india-engineering-degree/

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#32

No. At least not through the normal application process. I have worked with many brilliant Indian people, and some of my favorite colleagues were Indian. However, there is so much "noise" in India's talent pool [1] - bad communication, fake degrees, fake profiles, sloppy work - that it just takes too much effort filtering through it. I understand that it's biased, but simply not hiring from India seems to be the bett…

I am studying in an "engineering" "college" of India. ("top" college by Indian norms, but not IIT[1]). And I totally understand this.

The mentality of 'gaming the system' is deep rooted in education system here, probably because education is so rote-oriented, mechanical and namesake.

[1] I would have difficulty believing current generation of IIT students would be any good either. These days the entrance process for IITs has become pretty game-able and people with money and time do that.

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#33
post #28

I work for a distributed company. This means we have over ten offices all over the world. There is at least one office in India. It used to have many engineers, now it has few. The reasons: Engineers in India have this culture that values position more than skills. They think they must work only three years as developers and move to management as soon as they can, otherwise they are wasting time, or they think they a…

> They think they must work only three years as developers and move to management as soon as they can, otherwise they are wasting time, or they think they are a professional failure.

I am an Indian and to be honest, the hierarchical culture is horrible. People misattribute it to caste system but it is much much more than that. We aren't actually expected to straightforwardly say the professor / senior / elders are wrong.

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#36

Absolutely not. I work hard and pay high taxes without much complaint to try and help enrich both myself and the society I am a part of. Helping companies offshore work destroys local jobs, depresses salaries and helps the rich get all the richer at a time where they've already taken a disproportionate amount of the gains from the increases in productivity since the 70s and in that time, as the panama papers et al. h…

But you do realise that most of the products you use are probably Chinese manufactured?

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#37

...if a person's skill can be validated... Just as important as skill is productivity. And both are more difficult to access remotely. Credentials have limited substance in the US labor market. In India they have even less --- in my experience. There is no way to sugar coat this --- India has a credibility deficit in my opinion which translates into additional management oversight required.

Agreed but will you be wiling to put in their additional oversight (at least in the beginning)for more cost effective labor and potentially more work output (if effective systems are in place and there is good oversight). Note that the same devs are able to compete with their US peers in companies like Google, MS etc. who have local presence.

I really think your approach is kinda inside out.

The real question is, what are companies in India willing to do to gain credibility? Assembling a "warm body shop" doesn't add much.

Pick a problem space to specialize in, assemble a competent team and develop an open source app for it. Then use this as "proof of work" for marketing purposes.

You undoubtedly know Indian culture better than me --- what do you think is the most likely response to this sort of selection process?

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#38
A bunch of white people bashing devs in India and another group of wannabe NRIs sucking up to them.

Let me show the perspective of an Indian engineer. I don't want to work for remotely for a team with half a day of time zone difference. India has tons of interesting startups doing exciting work.

Most of the bright engineers are happy with the jobs or have their own network of other bright engineers to help with job hunting. Very few good engineers sign for remote work.

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#39
I would avoid it for most roles. And not just India, but really anywhere that's more than a 6 hour time difference from where I work (and even then, I would prefer less than a 4 hour time difference).

I work on a globally distributed team currently. It is exceptionally difficult to maintain cohesiveness as a team given that there are 0 hours per day that we are all online. What has ended up happening is that we have virtually fragmented into 3 separate teams with our own products. For instance, my team members in Asia are working on a product that I can't effectively support because my shift doesn't overlap. If someone asks me a question about that app, which my team is supposed to support, I have to go start reading source code. Lacking documentation is also an issue there, but that's nearly a universal problem.

Remote working tools are the hot new thing, but nothing effectively solves the timezone issue. Sure, we have async communication, but unless someone is logging in after hours (which I would heavily discourage), you only get one exchange (i.e. an email or Slack message) per day. That's a painfully slow way to collaborate.

That being said, there are roles where the time difference doesn't matter, and is advantageous. NOC and helpdesk (if helpdesk is 24 hours) are well suited to a "follow the sun" model. The team communication seems largely limited to passing off info about incidents, with very occasional full group meetings to give new policy info. They just aren't the prestigious roles typically associated with SV.

Re: Ask HN: If you are fully/partially remote, would you hire devs in India?

#40

A bunch of white people bashing devs in India and another group of wannabe NRIs sucking up to them. Let me show the perspective of an Indian engineer. I don't want to work for remotely for a team with half a day of time zone difference. India has tons of interesting startups doing exciting work. Most of the bright engineers are happy with the jobs or have their own network of other bright engineers to help with job h…

Finally! Thank you. I'd rather work for an Indian startup than go remote for an outside company.
Post reply on HN