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A day using money in Cuba

boazsobrado.com

51–60 of 186 posts

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#51

I actually went to Cuba on holiday, and I used the tourist dollars. It's incredible how this separates society into haves and have-nots. Basically everyone wants to be near the tourists. They'll invite you into their homes for food, they'll offer to take you around town, sell you some cigars, and so on. Since you have tourist bucks, you also have access to the tourist nightclubs, where you run into some regional cele…

Most of central america and the caribbean is like this, from my experience. I'm not convinced that it has to do with the two separate currencies.

It is not politically correct to state the reasons for this. For example:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sacrifice_in_Aztec_cultu...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sacrifice_in_Maya_cultur...

Unfortunately, some cultures have this as a part of their history. They need to be taught a different path.

Edit: In my other comment I was flagged, so I want to make sure I'm not misunderstood. I am not making a moral judgement here of any kind. I'm just trying to say, there are cultures out there that have no history of the Judeo-Christian faith, until much later when it was imposed by colonialists. I think this is a net benefit, because their cultural history before was to kill someone when it started raining or some other natural event.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#52

And as a tourist, you’d always get change back in the wrong currency (worth 1/25 the original). And to make matters worse, the change will also be wrong in their favour. Hated being assumed that I’m a dumb foreigner.

I did not experience that once on 3 trips to Cuba, all different parts.

Hmm, are you American?

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#53

Went to Cuba with my girl. (She really wanted to go; I was the skeptic.) Walking around the ruins of the Centrum, and someone invites her in to get a haircut. Sure, she says, why not? $5 (convertible), but all we had on hand was a $20. Little Cuban girl heads out running through the neighborhood to scrounge up change for a $20 because that’s almost a month’s salary.

Similar situation, although not as intense. I bought a skewer of grilled meat from a poor elderly woman in central Colombia. The skewer was 5,000 COP and all I had was a 50,000 note (which I discovered when the food was ready) which is about a day’s wage. She had to leave the grill and go out in the search for change. Felt terrible.

God forbid either of you let them keep the change

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of central america and the caribbean is like this, from my experience. I'm not convinced that it has to do with the two separate currencies.

It is not politically correct to state the reasons for this. For example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sacrifice_in_Aztec_cultu... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sacrifice_in_Maya_cultur... Unfortunately, some cultures have this as a part of their history. They need to be taught a different path. Edit: In my other comment I was flagged, so I want to make sure I'm not misunderstood. I am not making a moral…

this is an extremely bad take.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#55
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that this separation is more due to the fact that you’re rich, than any formal currency arrangement. Foreigners in the 1990s got the same treatment, before any formal dollarization or dual currency system existed. Cubans who make their money only from official sources are desperately poor. Those with connections abroad, connections to tourism or to the black market are richer. The money difference merely makes i…

> The police arrest those who spend too much time with foreigners. This is news to me. Do you have a source for this claim?

I’ve caused it, although approx 15 years ago when I was in Cuba for a month.

First time, an obviously dodgy couple in Havana approached me at night shortly after I arrived. I will usually be friendly and talk with anyone without prejudice. I enjoy talking to grifters and operators, and I will happily pretend to be a victim when it amuses me to do so if I only risk a few dollars. I have travelled enough to be somewhat careful and how to look after myself; I speak conversational Spanish which helps; and I am a white New Zealander which often avoids trouble, and it honestly also helps get out of trouble. Police took the couple away shortly after I started talking with them, and I was very concerned. However I managed to track down the relevant police station. A tourist hanging in police station for hours probably caused the police some hassle (they hard out lied and tried to deceive me, but I wasn’t deterred), so eventually the couple were released at about 4AM, and I was able to find out what happened. He was pimping her (absolutely not my scene), and they had been fined about USD4 which I just gave them. I think normal salary was USD5 per week, so they would have taken ages to pay it.

After that hideous experience in Havana, I decided to go to one of the gated touristy beach areas where I presumed every local was vetted. I did speak with locals, but avoided anyone that I thought was dodgy. But apparently one guy was arrested for talking to foreigners, which had included me, although he just wanted to practice English as far as I know (I never had a reason to suspect him of a darker ulterior motive). His friends said there was nothing I could do to help and that it wasn’t a big issue (maybe just par for the course, normal life), but I felt really helpless.

Another time a woman told me to pay a cop USD5 or else the cop would rape her. It didn’t feel like a scam on her part, she was truely scared, and I certainly wasn’t willing to risk anything so I paid the extortion. I think my only fault in that case was being a tourist. I probably should have reported the officer, but I was too surprised at the time to notice any ID, and even now I am unsure if there would have been retribution on her.

I suspect that if a tourist only speaks English, they might be less likely to cause trouble, and they are less likely to be aware of any trouble they cause. Being in ones own tourist bubble is a normal thing for tourists, and is often encouraged (everyone has the incentive for tourists to enjoy themselves and spend money), and it is often difficult for tourists to interact with locals in any meaningful manner (especially given that in a poor country a tourist is often relatively a millionaire, and often in tourist areas).

I am sure Cuba has changed, but I am also sure that the same authoritarian structures are still in place.

Overall, Cuba was the worst country I have ever been to for a feeling of hopeless authoritarianism. As a tourist I felt mostly untouchable, but the grind of the people living there was horrific (warning, politics: I do blame the US blockade for a large part of that, especially because I think it helped Castro stay in power). I have other friends that loved travelling there, so YMMV.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#56
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up in the Soviet Union though. As they say in Russia, "не учи отца ебаться". My parents have never been inside a Beriozka, nor any of my relatives. Shopping there presented an economic impossibility: you either had to have foreign currency (outright illegal for Soviet citizens, with severe punishment for possession, so that meant you'd be a foreigner) or convertible rubles ("invalutny ruble", not illegal, but…

i grew up in the soviet union too. даже если мы согласны с тем что коммунизм не был идеальным это не значит что берёзки доказывают это. so my point still stands.

> коммунизм не был идеальным (communism wasn't ideal)

Understatement of the century, quite literally.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#57
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not politically correct to state the reasons for this. For example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sacrifice_in_Aztec_cultu... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sacrifice_in_Maya_cultur... Unfortunately, some cultures have this as a part of their history. They need to be taught a different path. Edit: In my other comment I was flagged, so I want to make sure I'm not misunderstood. I am not making a moral…

this is an extremely bad take.

It isn't. For example, in the Indian subcontinent, honor killing of the bride and practices like sati were widespread and culturally accepted. Only until the British colonized these countries were these types of practices stopped. There are still native tribes in many places on the earth that practice cannibalism; if you were to approach these tribes, they would capture you and cook you. We can all agree this is a backward practice.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similar situation, although not as intense. I bought a skewer of grilled meat from a poor elderly woman in central Colombia. The skewer was 5,000 COP and all I had was a 50,000 note (which I discovered when the food was ready) which is about a day’s wage. She had to leave the grill and go out in the search for change. Felt terrible.

God forbid either of you let them keep the change

Random over-generosity is not a particularly effective charity pattern. If you feel that Hacker News denizens like ourselves happen to have too much money, there are a variety of organizations which can transmit sums of money to those in need: not just a one-time $15 at random with a special tax diverted to prop up the Cuban government, but on a recurring basis, every month, as part of a program to help eliminate worldwide poverty in a targeted manner, and sensitive to the dislocations that can come about as a result of carelessly deployed aid.

I use WorldVision to do this, personally (some of their non-evangelizing programs) as I appreciate their efficient organization, but there are other ones out there too. I can supply links to https://www.worldvision.org/donate and suggest interested parties consider a $40/mo sponsorship of a child's health and education at https://www.worldvision.org/sponsor-a-child

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#60
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i grew up in the soviet union too. даже если мы согласны с тем что коммунизм не был идеальным это не значит что берёзки доказывают это. so my point still stands.

> коммунизм не был идеальным (communism wasn't ideal) Understatement of the century, quite literally.

bruh. is the RF better or worse now? how are those term limits working out for you? was the west better or worse during the years 1932-33 during the famine (the same years that the US hit peak unemployment)? were the pogroms and the gulag better or worse than jim crow and segregation and racism? was state owned means of production better or worse than the gilded age?

like you're sitting here glibly dismissing something that's more nuanced than either yours or my hottake. what are you trying to accomplish?

edit: also how come you translated mine but not yours? and also why didn't you translate all the way?

>даже если мы согласны с тем что коммунизм не был идеальным это не значит что берёзки доказывают это

translation: even if we agree that communism wasn't ideal that doesn't mean beriozkas prove it.

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