A day using money in Cuba • Hacker News Board

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#11

Post by lordnacho » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:16 PM UTC

I actually went to Cuba on holiday, and I used the tourist dollars.

It's incredible how this separates society into haves and have-nots. Basically everyone wants to be near the tourists. They'll invite you into their homes for food, they'll offer to take you around town, sell you some cigars, and so on.

Since you have tourist bucks, you also have access to the tourist nightclubs, where you run into some regional celebrities. Or you can find some nice rooftop bars to lounge in.

But walk around a bit, and you realise most of town is not like this. There's a lot of run-down places and a fair bit of desperation. Women will come offer themselves up.

Driving around it was apparent that most of the island is mired in poverty, with only a few places that are like a mediterranean club or hotel. Everywhere else is empty shelves and rudimentary technology. You'll see industrial trucks used as buses, for instance. And famously the cars tend to be really, really old.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#12

Post by _iatg » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:19 PM UTC

m0zg wrote: post #2

This is what the Soviet Union had, except, of course, all prices were quoted in "internal" rubles. The dollar was always 70 "foreign" kopecks, but you couldn't get dollars, or convertible rubles unless you were a party apparatchik who could shop in "Beryozka": a network of stores that sold Western goods to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves, which it how it usually works. Foreign…

> those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves

I wouldn't be able to describe it any better way than this.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#13

Post by ken » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:24 PM UTC

As an American, this doesn't seem any stranger than our dual-units-of-measure system. One is defined in terms of the other. One is what we (mostly) use locally, and the other is what we use with anyone from any other country in the world. People living here know from experience and context which system is implicitly attached to a bare number.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#14

Post by enitihas » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:26 PM UTC

m0zg wrote: post #2

This is what the Soviet Union had, except, of course, all prices were quoted in "internal" rubles. The dollar was always 70 "foreign" kopecks, but you couldn't get dollars, or convertible rubles unless you were a party apparatchik who could shop in "Beryozka": a network of stores that sold Western goods to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves, which it how it usually works. Foreign…

If only I could upvote this multiple times.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#15

Post by kmonsen » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:27 PM UTC

danlugo92 wrote: post #5

m0zg wrote: post #2

This is what the Soviet Union had, except, of course, all prices were quoted in "internal" rubles. The dollar was always 70 "foreign" kopecks, but you couldn't get dollars, or convertible rubles unless you were a party apparatchik who could shop in "Beryozka": a network of stores that sold Western goods to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves, which it how it usually works. Foreign…

>to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves I'll violate the rule but I'll comment you were probably downvoted because of this part of your comment.

I don’t really see why though? I’m a socialist (the Scandinavian kind), but that seems a petty good description of what happened back then.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#16

Post by NikolaeVarius » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:29 PM UTC

ken wrote: post #13

As an American, this doesn't seem any stranger than our dual-units-of-measure system. One is defined in terms of the other. One is what we (mostly) use locally, and the other is what we use with anyone from any other country in the world. People living here know from experience and context which system is implicitly attached to a bare number.

They are in no way equivalent. Countries generally do not modify the conversion between metric and imperial for the purpose of obfuscating measurements of things,

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#17

Post by Aperocky » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:36 PM UTC

sremani wrote: post #3

China also has dual currency CNY-CNH system. https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/cnh-vs-cny-differences-betwe...

That's not really the same as you don't really spend CNH except use it to exchange currencies outside of China. That is, non of the locals or expats in China spend CNH - and their value is almost exactly the same because there is not an oversupply of either and both is anchored on the massive USD reserve China has.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#18

Post by throwlaplace » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:37 PM UTC

kmonsen wrote: post #15

danlugo92 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves I'll violate the rule but I'll comment you were probably downvoted because of this part of your comment.

I don’t really see why though? I’m a socialist (the Scandinavian kind), but that seems a petty good description of what happened back then.

because what the fuck do two department stores have to do with state owned means of production? somehow anything that's the slightest bit off shows that sOcialISm iS eViL but the same kind of bad faith reading of any of the structures of capitalism is explicitly forbidden.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#19

Post by Yetanfou » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:38 PM UTC

danlugo92 wrote: post #5

m0zg wrote: post #2

This is what the Soviet Union had, except, of course, all prices were quoted in "internal" rubles. The dollar was always 70 "foreign" kopecks, but you couldn't get dollars, or convertible rubles unless you were a party apparatchik who could shop in "Beryozka": a network of stores that sold Western goods to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves, which it how it usually works. Foreign…

>to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves I'll violate the rule but I'll comment you were probably downvoted because of this part of your comment.

It would be... unfortunate... if the truth leads to downvotes. If it is really the case that people downvoted for that reason I would really like to know the reason why as it would indicate either a failure of their history teachers or an ideological stance.

Re: A day using money in Cuba

#20

Post by vkou » Mon, May 25, 2020, 9:40 PM UTC

_iatg wrote: post #12

m0zg wrote: post #2

This is what the Soviet Union had, except, of course, all prices were quoted in "internal" rubles. The dollar was always 70 "foreign" kopecks, but you couldn't get dollars, or convertible rubles unless you were a party apparatchik who could shop in "Beryozka": a network of stores that sold Western goods to those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves, which it how it usually works. Foreign…

> those who imposed socialism on others, but did not live in it themselves I wouldn't be able to describe it any better way than this.

Can't our current economic system be described as rule by those who impose dog-eat-dog capitalism on others, but do not live in it themselves?

I think the common factor is that elites always find a way to insulate themselves from the problems of the plebs, including the ones that they have created.