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MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

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Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#351

Post by 3combinatorHN »

Nextgrid wrote: post #29
leephillips wrote: post #12

This is completely insane. I am so glad I decided years ago to leave closed operating systems behind. This design seems to cement the trend at Apple to position their products as consumer appliances, not platforms useful for development.

> I am so glad I decided years ago to leave closed operating systems behind. The problem is, there's nothing else out there. Everything is going to shit in one way or another. Windows is now a disaster, Linux was always a disaster in terms of user experience and isn't improving. Mac OS was the last bastion of somewhat good, thoughtful design, user experience and attention to detail and now they've gone to shit too.

I’m pretty sure that you have never use linux ... Just try it

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#352

Post by mjhoy »

soraminazuki wrote: post #327
mjhoy wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny, I just had to do this a few days ago. This comment has worked for me on two machines: https://github.com/NixOS/nix/issues/2925#issuecomment-539570...

There's just so many problems with that approach: 1. You have to create a separate volume just to install a package manager, which is a poor user experience 2. A separate volume means FileVault won't work out of the box 3. The volume can be mounted only after GUI apps are brought up 4. Restoring after sleep might fail because of 3 All of these are mentioned in the Github issue, but it might be hard to find because it…

1 — Sure. But Nix isn't exactly the most friendly package manager to begin with. I wouldn't recommend it if you're not comfortable creating volumes.

2 — Could you explain? Mine is on and working, I didn't need to do anything else.

3 — Is this if you have login items that need nix to be available? I don't have this so I haven't noticed.

4 — I've never run into this, but again I might just not use Nix for the kind of things that would cause issues.

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#353

Post by danudey »

glofish wrote: post #334
soraminazuki wrote: post #278

Up until the release of Catalina, I've always upgraded to the latest version of macOS within a month or two. But some of the changes this time is really stopping me from upgrading. As of Catalina, there's no sane way to install the Nix package manager without losing functionality because macOS now disallows creating new files in the root directory[1]. Nix stores its packages in the /nix directory and it's not possibl…

IMHO the original choice of the path seems incredibly ill-advised and the main burden lies with the original developers. sometimes old errors and mistakes come back and bite

I second this. Any tool which creates its own directory in the filesystem root (and cannot run from any other location) is inherently doing it wrong by any measure.

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#354

Post by smcameron »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #179
armatav wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does that even make sense? It’s an OS, go grab a Desktop Environment and download nvim, VSCode or whatever.

The original line that I was responding to was > Teaching my daughter to program on a modern computer, we spend more time bootstrapping and in process, than we do in actual development. Arch Linux does not help with this, unless you make it boot into a VIC-20 emulator or something. Arch can help with boot speed, but once you're booted you're back in a full modern OS. So fine, install VSCode and Python... okay, now yo…

How about Processing. https://processing.org/

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#355

Post by chacha2 »

halotrope wrote: post #97

I am using Ubuntu 20.04 on a Thinkpad X1 Extreme Gen2 and you would be surprised how "normal" it feels as a development machine. Sure there some little annoyances, the touchpad behaves a little worse than on windows, sound is a little worse. But the most important things, Keyboard and Screen are excellent. The system in general does not feel like the horror stories that people keep telling about linux on desktop(note…

Isn't Ubuntu much worse than this with the push for Snap packages? It can take 10-30 seconds to open software installed through it.

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#357

Post by 3combinatorHN »

BruceEel wrote: post #112
kick wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mac is a BSD. OpenBSD exists. FreeBSD exists. NetBSD exists. Because there are at least four BSDs, Mac therefore isn't good. Do you see how ridiculous applying that logic to any operating system is? Linux isn't a disaster. It's a kernel. There are Linux distributions with great user interfaces and great UX, developed by people who are great at it. There are also distributions that aren't.

> There are Linux distributions with great user interfaces and great UX Could you name some? No sarcasm, actually interested!

Stable distributions Fedora manjaro ubuntu UIX gnome kde xfce all works

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#358

Post by kick »

zozbot234 wrote: post #196
m463 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who have used ubuntu might want to just once try arch linux. I had an ubuntu machine that took a while to boot even with an SSD. Later I installed arch linux on the same machine and boom! it would be to the desktop in seconds. It was night and day.

Debian is just as quick, and does not have the problematic "rolling" updates of Arch. (It does have the "testing" and "unstable" channels which are roughly comparable, but the Debian folks won't tell you to use them in production.)

Debian is not just as quick (significantly slower and higher resource usage), but Arch isn't all that fast nowadays, either.

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#359

Post by seertaak »

levesque wrote: post #284
halotrope wrote: post #97

I am using Ubuntu 20.04 on a Thinkpad X1 Extreme Gen2 and you would be surprised how "normal" it feels as a development machine. Sure there some little annoyances, the touchpad behaves a little worse than on windows, sound is a little worse. But the most important things, Keyboard and Screen are excellent. The system in general does not feel like the horror stories that people keep telling about linux on desktop(note…

Windows is still very much subpar, even with support for CUDA in WSL2. Loading packages is terribly slow in Windows, for some reason. Also don't get me started on package management (no, Anaconda doesn't cut it).

I got pretty good results with chocolatey.

But I agree that even WSL2 didn't cut the mustard, and I doubt GPU support will fix it. MS is advancing too slow, I think.

Re: MacOS Catalina: Slow by Design?

#360

Post by zozbot234 »

soraminazuki wrote: post #346
glofish wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMHO the original choice of the path seems incredibly ill-advised and the main burden lies with the original developers. sometimes old errors and mistakes come back and bite

It only seems that way now because some platforms have begun locking down their root directories. Nix, by design, doesn't conform to the FHS way of organizing directories so it made perfect sense to use /nix when the decision was originally made.

> Nix, by design, doesn't conform to the FHS way of organizing directories

That's why /opt/ exists. What's wrong with /opt/nix/ ? Or /var/opt/nix/ for read-write files that need not be a fixed part of any package installation (the Unix equivalent of system-wide "Application Data").

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