An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015) • Hacker News Board

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#31

Post by gameswithgo » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:18 PM UTC

samirillian wrote: post #4

This is what I don't understand. When Tbray left, he said he was doing so in solidarity with the distribution center types, but he held to the line that AWS was great. This despite nightmare stories like this one regularly bubbling up, and I've heard similar from friends. What is it about tech culture that people within it refuse to admit the level of abuse-by-design that happens at these companies? Is it that they w…

Every company is full of nightmares, especially anyone doing something big enough to be interesting. For instance that guy who started blogging about how janky Tesla's software was, most of us who have been around a while read all that and shrugged. Not that bad. It is easy to imagine perfection or competence but very hard to actually achieve it at large scales with humans.

So at the same time it can be true that company X is a great place and also true that company X is a nightmare.

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#32

Post by ignoramous » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:19 PM UTC

rdiddly wrote: post #17

"If paged, you have 15 minutes to get online and respond to the page. If you don’t, your manager is paged. You do NOT want this to happen." I want it to happen. I'd like a word.

> I want it to happen. I'd like a word.

You could be shown the door in no-time. Amazon has forced attrition and the manager decides who gets the cull. They may make a mountain out of a mole to further their objectives.

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#33

Post by lowiqengineer » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:19 PM UTC

majormajor wrote: post #28

> Remember when I mentioned Amazon's moving and signing bonus? Little caveat on that, if you leave or are fired within 2 years, you have to pay it back. Paying back a signing bonus if they fire you seems super rough. Is this common elsewhere? 2 years also seems high - the time I got a signing bonus, it was "pay back if you leave voluntarily in 1 year" which was much nicer than the described. Unfortunately, much of th…

> Paying back a signing bonus if they fire you seems super rough. Is this common elsewhere? 2 years also seems high - the time I got a signing bonus, it was "pay back if you leave voluntarily in 1 year" which was much nicer than the described.

I actually don't think this is true. My understanding is if you're PIPed they don't really care. The signing bonus is paid out monthly the 2nd year (and for people hired at SDE2+ its first year too) so you don't have to pay it back after the first year.

Disclaimer: Amazon L4

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#34

Post by dlp211 » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:19 PM UTC

google234123 wrote: post #7

samirillian wrote: post #4

This is what I don't understand. When Tbray left, he said he was doing so in solidarity with the distribution center types, but he held to the line that AWS was great. This despite nightmare stories like this one regularly bubbling up, and I've heard similar from friends. What is it about tech culture that people within it refuse to admit the level of abuse-by-design that happens at these companies? Is it that they w…

Payroll tax? The website should be taxamazonworkers.net

Payroll taxes may or may not be borne by the worker. Oversimplifying tax burden is a dishonest argument that is consistently perpetuated.

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#35

Post by balladeer » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:20 PM UTC

> During the hiring process, on-call is not mentioned in any way

Then next:

> are you willing to work nights and/or weekends

To be fair I'd say this is mention enough.

If someone is willing to (or has to) look the other way at the time of hiring when something like this was explicitly said, then even a "hey, we have on-call here, you fine with that?" would be okay.

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#36

Post by lowiqengineer » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:20 PM UTC

redredrobot wrote: post #15

I appreciate this being shared, but I have some qualms. I think talking about the Leadership Principles as a 'typical corporate motto' is unfair. Amazon lives their leadership principles far more than the other companies I've seen. They don't include things they don't actually care about, like most corporate mottos do (you'll notice the lack of 'we care about our employees' or 'do no evil' LPs). At least in my experi…

> 'we care about our employees' or 'do no evil' LPs).

Customer Obsession is "do no evil".

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#37

Post by trynewideas » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:20 PM UTC

> I mention on-call duty because it is “peculiar” in that the only other profession requiring this kind of responsiveness is doctors

My only advice to this person is:

- talk to someone who does customer-facing tech support in your own company

- never take a job in customer-facing tech support

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#38

Post by radlad » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:21 PM UTC

maerF0x0 wrote: post #13

> I mention on-call duty because it is “peculiar” in that the only other profession requiring this kind of responsiveness is doctors, literal lifesavers. When you go on-call for the first time, it’s terrifying and tells you “holy crap, this is serious.” A key difference is that the oncall engineer is usually able to directly influence the quality and robustness of the systems being watched. Sort of like preventative…

Plus, AWS literally runs life-saving applications. Doctors need AWS online to authenticate and use all sorts of applications.

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#39

Post by aripickar » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:21 PM UTC

I have had a different experience with working at AWS. I've heard really terrible things working in retail, but AWS has been a pretty good place to work, with normal 9-5 hours. I can go more into detail about how my experience has been different from the article if people want.

Re: An Amazon programmer’s perspective (2015)

#40

Post by ng12 » Thu, May 21, 2020, 7:21 PM UTC

majormajor wrote: post #28

> Remember when I mentioned Amazon's moving and signing bonus? Little caveat on that, if you leave or are fired within 2 years, you have to pay it back. Paying back a signing bonus if they fire you seems super rough. Is this common elsewhere? 2 years also seems high - the time I got a signing bonus, it was "pay back if you leave voluntarily in 1 year" which was much nicer than the described. Unfortunately, much of th…

I've heard that companies rarely enforce these clauses unless you really burned a bridge. If anything they won't give you severance if you quit within the first year.