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Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

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Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#11

Post by ketanmaheshwari »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #6
Ididntdothis wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UBI has a lot of practical problems. Why not start at universal health care or wider affordability of affordable housing and education? Without that any UBI will immediately be eaten up by rising prices in these areas.

That's a common urban legend. The free market drives prices down, when demand goes up for flexible markets. It's easy to throw one or two economic terms around, but its a lot more complicated than 'people have more money == prices rise'.

I am really curious to learn more about why UBI will not drive the prices up. Could you indicate any articles that elaborate on this?

Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#13

Post by Infinitesimus »

paulcole wrote: post #3

Why can’t we outsource basic income to the private sector? Like VCs who give money to people who want to sit at home instead of lighting money on fire to exploit taxi drivers?

VCs primarily care about outsized monetary returns and you don't get that from giving money to people.

Tax-deductible charitable donations are probably the closest way to incentivize the private sector but VCs was more, not just to stay flat and most businesses don't make decisions for "the greater good" over more $$.

Can you think of a way to incentivize private experiments in UBI?

Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#14

Post by monadic2 »

bigbob2 wrote: post #7

Maybe he can use it to endorse another moderate Democrat who would never dream of enacting such a policy.

> moderate Democrat

What the fuck is this bullshit?

Edit: apparently people like politician dick served up by the media.

Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#15

Post by happytoexplain »

Ididntdothis wrote: post #4
rocketpastsix wrote: post #2

Given everything that is going on, the case should be fairly straight forward to build. In fact, Yang has bene on top of it since Covid19 took hold in America. I truly hope UBI gains more popularity and strength going forward.

UBI has a lot of practical problems. Why not start at universal health care or wider affordability of affordable housing and education? Without that any UBI will immediately be eaten up by rising prices in these areas.

It seems to me that many people are trying desperately to push all of these proposals, and it's been a borderline immobile uphill battle on all fronts. If any of these gain traction, we should celebrate, rather than accusing people of not yet achieving the others. It also makes sense that UBI would be the first to reach the staging phase, since it's the easiest to explain and the easiest to implement.

Of course, your concern is still totally valid if UBI will indeed be pointless without the other problems solved. I just wanted to point out how easy it is to say "start with universal health care and affordability of housing and education". That's a huge thing to "start with", and in fact we're already deep into the fight for them.

Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#16

Post by Proven »

throwaway_jobs wrote: post #5

I don’t think there is any good way to test UBI at any small scale, I think there needs to be a critical mass of people who can pay their housing and food costs how society and economic activity would be reshaped under such a system.

Really? Just like Krugman's QE!

How am I going to get back my devalued savings once we find out it doesn't work, all savers have been ruined and fiat money has no value?

There's no need to test it on any scale, including small, because it can't work.

Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#17

Post by yboris »

Ididntdothis wrote: post #4
rocketpastsix wrote: post #2

Given everything that is going on, the case should be fairly straight forward to build. In fact, Yang has bene on top of it since Covid19 took hold in America. I truly hope UBI gains more popularity and strength going forward.

UBI has a lot of practical problems. Why not start at universal health care or wider affordability of affordable housing and education? Without that any UBI will immediately be eaten up by rising prices in these areas.

A response to what happens to markets when people have more money:

More people enter and participate in markets, which makes markets work better.

Markets behave better with more participants than with fewer participants. UBI is a net positive on this point.

Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#19

Post by MiroF »

exabrial wrote: post #8

Which is incredibly charitable! Opponents to UBI only oppose the income source being tax; which is a forced wealth transfer (opposite of my money my choice).

> opposite of my money my choice

you cite this as if it's some commonly accepted moral principle

Re: Jack Dorsey is giving Andrew Yang $5M to build the case for a basic income

#20

Post by JoeAltmaier »

ketanmaheshwari wrote: post #11
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a common urban legend. The free market drives prices down, when demand goes up for flexible markets. It's easy to throw one or two economic terms around, but its a lot more complicated than 'people have more money == prices rise'.

I am really curious to learn more about why UBI will not drive the prices up. Could you indicate any articles that elaborate on this?

Better question: why would it? Economics is complicated.

In a free market there's no way to distinguish 'UBI money' from any other kind. Try jacking your price up - somebody else will have a sale and eat your lunch.

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