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Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

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Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#941
post #226
post #63

Youtube is in a tough spot. They will be blamed: - if they don't take down speech some consider hateful - if they take down speech some do not consider hateful 共匪 is seen as an insult by a group, but others do not. If Youtube bans nothing, then hate speech thrives and they get bad PR. If Youtube bans anything anyone flags as hate speech, then they become de facto as censorship agents for foreign powers. Anything crit…

Strongly disagree, there are some blurred lines around hate speech, but this isn’t one of them at all. This is a critique of a political party, that’s clear cut not hate speech.

Your comment proves the guy's point. Hate speech is subjective. There is no "blurred lines" around hate speech. All hate speech is protected speech. Supreme Court has repeatedly ruled on that.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/201...

If we don't have hate speech, we necessarily don't have free speech. All speech should be allowed. Hate speech should be criticized but not banned.

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#942
post #846

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I made this a collapsed stub comment to collect replies, since we don't want to distract the top of the thread too much.

Speaking of meta-issues, this article seems to have just dropped to the second page, and is sitting below older articles with 10-15x fewer votes. Perhaps worth checking whether any jiggery-pokery is going on.

You can't derive story rank from timestamp and point score alone—the system is more complex than that and includes many countervailing factors, including user flags, software downweights, and moderation downweights. All of this is to try to prevent the front page by being dominated by the few hottest and most outrageous topics of the day, which is what would happen without them. I've reduced one downweight, though, so this one is back on the front page now.

There was a huge thread earlier about the rank of this thread and related ones relative to others, which you'll find somewhere in these pages.

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#943
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Western companies don’t talk about values, Western governments do. The past few decades have seen an aggressive destruction in the power of Western governments to subdue them to Corporate power. The US is a prime example where the Republican party’s only policy platform (not even exaggerating) is “tax cuts are the solution to every problem”. The US government specifically has been declawed and dismembered by the curr…

>Western companies don’t talk about values, Western governments do. This is completely wrong. Every other ad on TV in the US is preaching about how much Walmart/Amazon/Pepsi/etc. care about the environment/LGBT rights/safe working conditions/etc. Western companies talk about their supposed values _all the time_, they're just mostly full of shit when they do.

I’m talking specifically about values in an international context. Google won’t try to enforce free speech values it loves when operating in China. They will abide with warantless searches there if need be.

The US government though has more power to resist such demands acting as a sovereign equal to the Chinese State.

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#944
post #891

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try hiding your business’s website from Google and see how that goes for you.

Exactly, Google provides a lot of value. Stop acting like this is a one sided transaction. If you don't like the value proposition, you're free to leave anytime.

Just like everyone is free to leave their power company and install solar panels, just like everyone can leave their water company and have water tankered in. Just like you can leave your telecom company and use satellite data.

Just because a company is providing value that doesn't mean that it shouldn't be regulated. Just because you can technically leave a service doesn't necessarily mean that you aren't realistically locked into it and that that service isn't going to exploit that fact.

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#945
post #796

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In some conversations bad actors can gain more power in a debate using misleading information than a good actor can by using the truth. Can "actors" be neatly divided into "good" and "bad"? Who decides who is a "good actor" and who is a "bad actor"? Your judgement of who is "good" and "bad" may well differ from mine.

> Your judgement of who is "good" and "bad" may well differ from mine. One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

Usually that only works if you ignore the definition of terrorism.

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#946
post #844
post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are articles about him on WikiSpooks[0] and Conservapedia[1]. [0] https://wikispooks.com/wiki/Eric_Ciaramella [1] https://www.conservapedia.com/Eric_Ciaramella

Is Conservapedia satire? > Ciaramella, who has been derided by critics as a beta male, is represented by kiddie-porn lawyer Mark Zaid. Regardless of political leaning, you can't take anything like this seriously, surely.

Wow, that website is really something. Feels like peeking into the mind of a deranged person.

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#947
post #63

Youtube is in a tough spot. They will be blamed: - if they don't take down speech some consider hateful - if they take down speech some do not consider hateful 共匪 is seen as an insult by a group, but others do not. If Youtube bans nothing, then hate speech thrives and they get bad PR. If Youtube bans anything anyone flags as hate speech, then they become de facto as censorship agents for foreign powers. Anything crit…

Douglas Murray said it well [1]: TLDR; the problem is that the tech companies have been flooded with people of a particular political kind after their political factions lost. They went to Facebook and google bringing strong convictions with them. They try to deal with things like hate without having thought deeply about it. What’s the next human emotion you’ll try to eradicate? Lustfulness? Gluttony? Envy? A war on…

What makes you think these companies haven't thought deeply about the issue, other than the fact that you disagree with their actions?

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#948
post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here are some numbers to keep you up at night, they are very scary: Google controls 91.89% of the search market [1] G controls 68% of the browser market [2] G's android is on 84% of phones operating systems [3] G has 73% of the search advertising market [4] [1] https://gs.statcounter.com/search-engine-market-share [2] https://www.statista.com/statistics/544400/market-share-of-i... [3] https://beta.trimread.com/articl…

At risk of nitpicking, why do say "controls" rather than e.g. "services" or "handles"? When you say "controls" it's like you're saying Google has some kind of monopoly power that makes it hard to switch. And yet anyone can easily switch to e.g. DuckDuckGo. If that's a monopoly, it's not quite the kind of a monopoly we should generally be worried about. Browsers would be a different issue. In that case, there are netw…

> If that's a monopoly, it's not quite the kind of a monopoly we should generally be worried about.

All available search engines run on ads and offer roughly the same service. There is no competition in the market from the perspective of the consumer. How is this healthy?

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#949

YouTube filtering slurs and hateful memes is not surprising. They would target anything that gets spammed and reduces the quality of discourse (such as it is on YouTube). I see no evidence that China is getting any special treatment here. It was the subject of hateful spam, so now it gets a filter. Same would apply to any other country or topic. From my perspective, the absolutist "freedom of speech"/anti-censorship…

You have quite an expansive definition of slur! It's an insult to every anti-racist, anti-bigotry campaign in history to say that any political party should get to hide behind this kind of crybaby b.s. -- much less a party that operates concentration camps. Or are they, too, "people simply trying to keep the room clean" in your book?

First, you need to re-read what I wrote. I didn't call it a slur. I called it a hateful meme.

It's precisely that, because it is driven by hate -- you will understand this if you talk to people who deeply hate communism, such as in my experience Czech people who suffered under it -- and it's a meme, something repeated for social reasons, not to cultivate understanding.

If you can understand what's driving the kids to spam "communist bandits", you will see its ugliness. If you can't, then it's like a curse word in a foreign language: of course you don't mind. It remains, however, a foul little turd to all the people who do understand the context and the language, and who have adequate taste and intellect to prefer higher minded discourse.

To directly address your mischaracterization, this is not crybaby-ism; it's taste and the desire for substance. Nobody is crying about kids posting the hateful meme "communist bandits." I have no affinity for communism myself. I would take equal disgust in kids spamming "capitalist pigs". It's just dumb and ugly.

Give me a thesis with supporting evidence and citations. Meanwhile, delete (indeed, censor!) all the childish and simpleminded spam, so I don't have to be immersed in stupidity and hate when endeavoring to broaden my understanding.

You seem to not mind wading through filth, but most highly verbal adults share my preferences. We leave forums when the filth piles up, and the "discourse" that remains after we're gone reflects this reality.

And now we get to you. Some of us try to be bigger than calling each other crybabies, and calling their positions bullshit. What you wrote violates Hacker News rules. I'm not going to report you, because despite your unflattering model of me, I can pluck out a fly that lands in my whiskey glass without crying about it. This thread should be dead enough that you should be safe, but I'll regret my decision if you go on to attack other people.

I instead hope whatever is broken inside you gets healed, so that you can more effectively tackle what I agree is a problem: a government that forces citizens to literally watch their backs after they voice their mind is influencing countries and companies abroad. Right now, with your hostility, you're just poisoning the well.

Re: Google deletes “communist bandits” from comments on Youtube

#950

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah pretty much all of HN's lines about how it's much better than other communities go out the window. Perhaps such conversations can be had productively, but I've yet to see it.

I challenge you to find an on-line community whose average is better than HN's worst. I really do. I might start visiting it; we lack civilized places on the Internet.

Do you have show dead on or ever check the bottom page/new posts?
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