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Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

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181–190 of 219 posts

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#181
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>...the US government of the last 10-15 years doesn't have the same viewpoints on anti-trust that they did 20+ years ago. The Nintendo NES came out in 1983. Didn't they have control of all apps allowed to run on their machine? They weren't charged with anti-trust violations.

This is actually a really interesting parallel. Like Apple/Google, Nintendo also became successful in part by tightly regulating their console in response to a quality problem previously caused by more open platforms[1]. The comparison breaks down somewhat though when you consider the size of the NES market (61.91 million units sold) vs. smartphones (1 billion+ sold). Nintendo, and the whole gaming market, may have j…

That's an interesting comparison to make, since ultimately Nintendo lost their court case regarding their control over who's allowed to create and publish NES games.

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#183
post #117
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. The only other option is to limit your service to only desktop PCs/websites which is not super helpful to normal people that just use their phones for everything. Google has a monopoly on phone apps. If they don't like your app then you pretty much don't exist. You don't have many options.

"Normal people" do not just use their phones for everything. Normal people use their phones for getting around and they stare at the screen when they are bored, for example waiting for a bus or waiting in line. When they want to do real work or real play they don't do it on their phone, they need a larger form factor with more power, a bigger screen, and better input technology, whether that is a laptop/desktop or ga…

> If it's not related to helping you move around from place to place, or helping you connect to a friend quickly, it's not going to thrive on the phone even if you put it there, ...

Then why is the games category the #1 promoted category on the Apple App Store?

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All apps are sandboxed in Android... even the ones installed externally.

Obviously not well enough considering what happened with Fortnite....

What happened to Fortnite?

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#185
post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So Apple's motivations were solely altruistic, whereas mean old Google is just a money grubbing copycat? I'm being snarky, but it seems a little naive to think either of these companies wasn't eager to capitalize on the lucrative mobile software market. Aren't you also prevented from buying subscriptions or making other in-app purchases within iOS apps (but not through the app store's integrated system)? Seems like t…

When Apple did it, it wasn't at all clear that there would be a lucrative mobile software market. What was clear is that the success of their platform absolutely depended on applications not giving the platform a bad name. And insisting on control was typical Steve Jobs. Apple's motivations for continuing to charge outrageous fees are, of course, that they want to keep the free money rolling in. And they must have ho…

> * What was clear is that the success of their platform absolutely depended on applications not giving the platform a bad name.*

Yes, but I see this as Apple desiring tight control, first and foremost (as you hint at). Helping cut a potential malware problem off at the pass was a nice side benefit. I see the flow of causation in the other direction here. Apple just wanted control, because that's just how they do things. Initially they weren't even going to allow third-party apps.

This cuts both ways: while you can't distribute obvious malware on Apple's App Store, you also can't distribute perfectly benign things that people want, but Apple has decided is distasteful... to them.

> By contrast Google was deliberately creating an open platform on open sourced software.

I think that's a fairly naive view of it. They believed that open-sourcing the OS was the best way to gain market share (which worked, for all Android's fragmentation and faults). I sincerely doubt it had much to do with some desire for openness; that would contrast pretty sharply with most of the rest of Google.

> Their decision to lock down this piece was opposite the rest of the product direction.

Except they didn't lock it down! I have several apps on my phone installed via F-Droid. The Facebook Lite app used to (I uninstalled FB a couple years ago, so not sure if it's still the case) have the ability to manage and install its own updates (I assume for lower-spec/non-Google-Apps phones in developing markets). If I feel I can trust an app I download off the internet, I can install it. I have a couple of my own apps installed on the phone, without needing to pay Apple a $99 gate-keeping fee, and the software to install them is open source, not wrapped up in proprietary Xcode.

I will be the first to agree that most people don't avail themselves of this option, and an app developer who doesn't publish in the Google Play Store is kneecapping their market reach. But the fact that it's possible (and not even difficult) to do is the point. Sideloading on an iPhone is something that costs money; requires specialized skills, tools, and a particular brand of hardware; and is out of reach for the vast majority of people who (for example) would otherwise sideload on Android.

> * And it is hard to believe that they weren't looking at the demonstration of what happened with the iPhone and were trying to replicate the revenue model.*

I'm sure that was part of it, but... so what? I don't really see this as indicative of a particular mindset.

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously not well enough considering what happened with Fortnite....

What happened to Fortnite?

https://www.cnet.com/news/just-as-critics-feared-fortnite-fo...

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#187
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way I see it, a well-funded and very popular entity tried to bypass Google’s stranglehold (and high taxes) on app distribution. Even they ultimately failed to maintain independent distribution. They probably invested quite a few engineering hours to devise a solution, as there’s a lot of code / Google services that need to be replicated. It’s unsurprising to me that there were some bugs in this code, and I think…

Are you as forgiving about security issues with Zoom?

It’s OT but I will totally forgive Zoom for their security issues. Their CEO openly admitted they were wrong, promised to fix it, made real changes fairly quickly to better lock down default settings, have upgraded their ciphers, and made a major acquisition to build-out their security chops (Keybase) to address the larger problem of easy to use key management.

Personally I’ve relied on Zoom to get meetings running quickly (without wasting precious time fighting with hard to install client software) many times on meetings where I would gladly trade ease of use for security posture.

I think Zoom messed up but has shown they can admit fault and course correct.

They are—as far as I’m aware—an entirely content neutral communications network that lets me pay for a service, doesn’t try to analyze and data mine my content, isn’t operating as a middleman between me and my customers, and isn’t at risk of becoming my competitor if it detects my product is becoming successful. They aren’t leveraging a monopoly position to maximize rent seeking and crushing the little guy through arbitrarily enforced content moderation policies. They aren’t exploiting cheap labor or phish a business to intercept their customers.

So as far as growth-hacks go, playing some API tricks on Mac and Windows to get their client ridiculously easy to install and running in a meeting — which risked you entering a meeting without an extra prompt, or potentially provided a pivot for unsigned code....

Frankly they seem about as un-villainous as they come in terms of publicly listed tech companies or venture-backed unicorns.

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#188
post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But once you have a sandbox, you limit what the app can do. Would the outspoken users on Android be happy if the sandbox for side loaded apps restricted functionality they wanted?

Yes, the issues highlighted in the thread stem not from the technical limitations of Android sandboxing but political censorship by Google. Covid-19 isn't transmitted through apps. This is a stereotypical false dilemma fallacy, where users are artificially forced to chose between security and censorship.

And government wouldn’t try even harder to censor? The big thing in the early 90s was the government going out of its way to try to force the record labels to censor hip hop groups like NWA (F the Police) , 2 Live Crew, and Ice T (Cop Killer).

Do you remember all of the moral panic about violent video games after Mortal Kombat came out?

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#189
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you as forgiving about security issues with Zoom?

It’s OT but I will totally forgive Zoom for their security issues. Their CEO openly admitted they were wrong, promised to fix it, made real changes fairly quickly to better lock down default settings, have upgraded their ciphers, and made a major acquisition to build-out their security chops (Keybase) to address the larger problem of easy to use key management. Personally I’ve relied on Zoom to get meetings running q…

You mean “API tricks” like surreptitiously installing an always running web server on Macs so that it could reinstall itself when the user uninstalled it?

They aren’t sorry for doing it. They are sorry for getting caught....

Re: Google bans my events app for referencing Covid-19, or related terms

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happened to Fortnite?

https://www.cnet.com/news/just-as-critics-feared-fortnite-fo...

> For the attack to work, it sounds like you would have already needed to have a piece of malware on your phone, ready and waiting to strike. But not a particularly sophisticated one. After you ask the Fortnite Launcher to download Fortnite, Google claims that any app with the WRITE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE permission would have been able to sneakily replace the real Fortnite app with a fake one after security checks were already complete. It's known as a "man-in-the-disk" attack.
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