Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Termux and Android 10

github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 329 posts

Re: Termux and Android 10

#81

Post by Andrew_nenakhov »

mmsimanga wrote: post #62
larrik wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has been on Linux a long time, but still has to support family members using Windows, here's my perspective: 1) Linux is usually easier in the "happy case", where everything works as it should, and it supports everything that the user needs. 2) Linux is way way way less likely to just change something and break the whole system while the user is sleeping. (This was REAL fun with my grandparents-in-law…

7) It's way easier to find someone you know to help you on Windows than Linux, for now. I visit my parents once a year and always mark out a day to spend fixing/updating/removing junk on my dad's Windows laptop. Three times I installed Linux and when I came back the following year Windows was back on the laptop. The reason being people just know Windows where I am from and the moment they see Linux they feel that's t…

I have installed Ubuntu to my mom and my wife's parents PCs and I never ever spent time having to worry about those computers again. They instantly learn where the browser, skype and printer menu is, and NEVER have a problem with a computer again. I also never worried about antiviruses and malware since.

They are all in their 70s. No regular user has a problem with Ubuntu these days, but they regularly did have all kinds of trouble with Windows.

I also run a business and for the last 13 years have had countless new hires (non developers) who have never seen Ubuntu and were productive on it instantly, without any problems with the OS ever.

So it is simply not true that people "feel there is a problem the moment they see Linux". Ubuntu is the most friendly and reliable OS for a regular person out there, I say it from decades of experience.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#82

Post by zozbot234 »

kagenouta wrote: post #76
zozbot234 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linux phones are nice since they provide things like mainline kernel support which is important for the long term, but many cheap Android devices can be modded to run custom firmware. (The PostmarketOS is working on providing "baseline" Linux installs for those devices.)

Also worth noting that one of Google's long-term goals is to make Android bootable on mainline. They've been slowly upstreaming the patches they built into Android's base kernel, and their Treble roadmap involves further isolating the hardware drivers, to enable running a generic kernel across devices.

Yes and AIUI, libhybris is working on supporting those userspace hardware drivers on a non-AOSP install. The postmarketOS folks would rather do without using downstream code/drivers/firmware at all and keep everything upstream based, but some devices will need this and it might also be useful for quick bring up on new devices.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#83

Post by Andrew_nenakhov »

larrik wrote: post #43
pathartl wrote: post #4

I'm really starting to despise most OS's for having such an overbearing security policy. I think it's really why I've stuck with Windows for so long. For sure Windows is not as user-stupid as something like macOS, iOS, Android, etc... but for me as a power user it's just about as powerful as I need to be. I'm not even considering *nix distros here because honestly the market for every day users for something like Ubu…

As someone who has been on Linux a long time, but still has to support family members using Windows, here's my perspective: 1) Linux is usually easier in the "happy case", where everything works as it should, and it supports everything that the user needs. 2) Linux is way way way less likely to just change something and break the whole system while the user is sleeping. (This was REAL fun with my grandparents-in-law…

> 9) The few times I've gotten family members to try Linux, they called me LESS often for support. Even on laptops!

This is so true.

All my family members are on Ubuntu, and it just works without any support. For many many years. Sometimes when I visit them I click on update to the next LTS. By the time I have to leave it is updated and runs again for 2 more years.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#84

Post by axegon_ »

Well that's annoying... I'm not a heavy termux user, but it's been extremely useful in some situations - ssh proxy over abd in very restricted networks mainly.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#85

Post by mixedCase »

mjg59 wrote: post #77
esotericn wrote: post #67

I ordered a PinePhone the other day and I'm going to do as much as I can to try and make it my daily driver. I really can't be arsed with this stuff any more. Why are the developers at Google acting in such boneheaded ways? Is it literally just "I get paid loads of money, lol"? Do people not grow out of that eventually when they have enough? Like, you're literally a developer. Why would you make something you wouldn'…

> Why are the developers at Google acting in such boneheaded ways? (I'm a developer at Google, but I'm not on the Android team and am definitely not providing any sort of official response here - this is personal opinion and may be inaccurate) If apps can download arbitrary code and then execute it, they can bypass the validation that's done as part of the Play Protect program. My understanding is that there's plenty…

Okay, can I just get a big popup on the Play Store saying "this app requires the following functionality that could harm your device:

- Run and use other applications without your consent

Unless you know precisely that this behavior is necessary for this application's main functionality, we recommend you do not proceed". And use some design pattern to make "Cancel" the "go-to" action for the user.

Or even more palatable for whoever's behind Play Protect: Forbid these apps from the Play Store, and force it be done through a 3rd party store or manually, and this can be combined with the big popup.

We know it's important to protect grandma from malware, but it's also important to give the advanced user the option to ignore this, specially for a platform like Android that has gained the favor of many technical users through providing some reasonable degree of control over their phones.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#86

Post by Sebb767 »

AsyncAwait wrote: post #42
sxp wrote: post #13

I really hope they figure out a good solution for this problem. One way I distinguish between a "real" computer and a toy or appliance is whether you can use the device to write software for it. With Termux, you can write Linux-style programs on the Android device itself or even build full Android apks. One of the other awesome things about Termux is that you can use it to setup a pretty complete ARM Linux environmen…

The only "real" solution is to get an actual Linux phone, such as the PinePhone[1] or Librem 5[2]. 1 - https://www.pine64.org/pinephone 2 - https://puri.sm/products/librem-5

But you pay 750$ for a 3GB quad core phone; I've got these specs on a 300€ OnePlus One five (six?) years ago.

Sure, replaceable battery and open hardware are a _very_ good thing, but the value/$ of these phones are horrendous. That's not to defend OnePlus or any other manufacturer, but when I can get a high end Samsung or Xiaomi device with 4 times the specs at every corner for the same price or less and simply install Lineage on it.

I definitely support the effort and I love that they finally got the design modern, but those prices are hard to swallow, even for someone pretty privacy-focused.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#87

Post by esotericn »

mjg59 wrote: post #77
esotericn wrote: post #67

I ordered a PinePhone the other day and I'm going to do as much as I can to try and make it my daily driver. I really can't be arsed with this stuff any more. Why are the developers at Google acting in such boneheaded ways? Is it literally just "I get paid loads of money, lol"? Do people not grow out of that eventually when they have enough? Like, you're literally a developer. Why would you make something you wouldn'…

> Why are the developers at Google acting in such boneheaded ways? (I'm a developer at Google, but I'm not on the Android team and am definitely not providing any sort of official response here - this is personal opinion and may be inaccurate) If apps can download arbitrary code and then execute it, they can bypass the validation that's done as part of the Play Protect program. My understanding is that there's plenty…

I think you've missed my point here, this goes _way_ further than this specific individual issue.

The entire ecosystem is built on a model that turns it into a disposable toy and there's no sign that this is going away any time soon.

Why do we need hobbyist movements to produce devices that we can actually run real software on and that won't be completely useless as soon as Google decide to update the API?

Re: Termux and Android 10

#88

Post by chx »

tmpz22 wrote: post #17
sxp wrote: post #13

I really hope they figure out a good solution for this problem. One way I distinguish between a "real" computer and a toy or appliance is whether you can use the device to write software for it. With Termux, you can write Linux-style programs on the Android device itself or even build full Android apks. One of the other awesome things about Termux is that you can use it to setup a pretty complete ARM Linux environmen…

Tablet companies really need to realize that a decent tablet with a decent dev experience is going to lead to an explosion of developers on their platform and result directly in way higher quality apps and therefore way better sales and brand. Imagine if websites couldn’t be developed on normal desktop computers and you had to run an extremely inefficient emulator every time you wanted to make a small notification.

> Tablet companies really need to realize that a decent tablet with a decent dev experience is going to lead to an explosion of developers on their platform

What do you base this statement on?

Re: Termux and Android 10

#89

Post by eeZah7Ux »

esotericn wrote: post #67

I ordered a PinePhone the other day and I'm going to do as much as I can to try and make it my daily driver. I really can't be arsed with this stuff any more. Why are the developers at Google acting in such boneheaded ways? Is it literally just "I get paid loads of money, lol"? Do people not grow out of that eventually when they have enough? Like, you're literally a developer. Why would you make something you wouldn'…

Google's primary business is mining user's data and selling it to advertisers.

Having corporate control over the device is paramount.

Therefore, the user must not install software from other sources.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#90

Post by na85 »

Sebb767 wrote: post #86
AsyncAwait wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only "real" solution is to get an actual Linux phone, such as the PinePhone[1] or Librem 5[2]. 1 - https://www.pine64.org/pinephone 2 - https://puri.sm/products/librem-5

But you pay 750$ for a 3GB quad core phone; I've got these specs on a 300€ OnePlus One five (six?) years ago. Sure, replaceable battery and open hardware are a _very_ good thing, but the value/$ of these phones are horrendous. That's not to defend OnePlus or any other manufacturer, but when I can get a high end Samsung or Xiaomi device with 4 times the specs at every corner for the same price or less and simply insta…

>value/$ of these phones are horrendous

Sounds like you value the open/libre aspect at $0. Not everyone feels the same way: Those phones are for people who value the replaceable battery and libre stack at $x where x > 0.

Post reply on HN