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Age Reduction Breakthrough?

joshmitteldorf.scienceblog.com

111–120 of 426 posts

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#111

> Most of the explosion in aging research (and virtually all the venture capital startups) are looking to treat aging at the cellular level.... The truth, as Katcher understands it, is that, to a large extent, aging is coordinated system-wide via signal molecules in the blood. So the SV execs with their fit young blood-bois were right all along?

I had the exact same thought. I wonder where those execs get the information from and more importantly, how the information is filtered, because they are clearly a few years ahead of what's being posted on, say, HN.

It was widely reported years ago. The future is already here it's just not affordable.

I remember talking about recent news that a few of us had heard about promising "young blood rejuvenation" with a bunch of random hicks in the woods of central Maine in the spring of 2014.

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#112

Since it seems like the upshot of all of this is that Katcher is claiming to have discovered a set of signalling molecules which, when injected, rejuvenate tissue and presumably lengthen life, it runs into one of the most fundamental objections that can be leveled at theory of aging (or cure thereof): of the billions of humans that have existed, how is it that none of them have possessed a mutation which (in this cas…

So you can live longer, but what about cancer?

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#113

Since it seems like the upshot of all of this is that Katcher is claiming to have discovered a set of signalling molecules which, when injected, rejuvenate tissue and presumably lengthen life, it runs into one of the most fundamental objections that can be leveled at theory of aging (or cure thereof): of the billions of humans that have existed, how is it that none of them have possessed a mutation which (in this cas…

To put it simply, a population with aging is more fit than a population without. The speed at which beneficial mutations in a population reach saturation in the gene pool is a function of the number of generations that have gone by. So we can expect some downward selective pressure on lifespan.

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#114

Since it seems like the upshot of all of this is that Katcher is claiming to have discovered a set of signalling molecules which, when injected, rejuvenate tissue and presumably lengthen life, it runs into one of the most fundamental objections that can be leveled at theory of aging (or cure thereof): of the billions of humans that have existed, how is it that none of them have possessed a mutation which (in this cas…

Maybe because people tend to reproduce fairly early in life (usually half of lifespan) so living an extra X years doesn't really allow you to have more children, and therefore the mutation of longer life doesn't get a huge enough advantage in natural selection?

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#115
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who had this mutation could have died of causes other than aging.

My first thought too - maybe it's just wishful thinking, but the bible does talk about people who lived for thousands of years. We're prone to dismiss this as hyperbole from uneducated ancients, but maybe they actually did exist and this sort of thing was why.

"Someone slipped up the distinction between years and generations and a legend was born" still seems enormously more probable than anomalous longevity existing but somehow never making it into the wider gene pool.

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#116

Since it seems like the upshot of all of this is that Katcher is claiming to have discovered a set of signalling molecules which, when injected, rejuvenate tissue and presumably lengthen life, it runs into one of the most fundamental objections that can be leveled at theory of aging (or cure thereof): of the billions of humans that have existed, how is it that none of them have possessed a mutation which (in this cas…

There are tons of reasons this wouldn’t have happened. Lots of this is speculation but:

Seems likely this is a gradient, not a binary thing, so perhaps someone with a beneficial mutation would just live a little longer. There’s not a ton of evolutionary pressure at the old age side of the spectrum, you’re not reproducing a lot, so it may not get picked up.

Wilder speculation: it could be that indeed this has been happening and is why humans live about 2x as long as chimps and gorillas.

Personally I think it’s quite unlikely that in humans single genes would have large deltas on age. There are maybe a few hints from supercentenarians (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Research_into_centenarians) that telomerase and other genes have some effect, but the “one gene for aging” in humans is elusive. As a result, it’s hard to predict how all this would play out evolutionarily.

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#117

Since it seems like the upshot of all of this is that Katcher is claiming to have discovered a set of signalling molecules which, when injected, rejuvenate tissue and presumably lengthen life, it runs into one of the most fundamental objections that can be leveled at theory of aging (or cure thereof): of the billions of humans that have existed, how is it that none of them have possessed a mutation which (in this cas…

We don’t know it’s zero. What fraction of humans who have ever lived have died of old age?

We could have age-proof people living among us today who happen to die in car accidents or any number of other causes.

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#118
post #11

As someone entirely outside this field, can someone with more inside knowledge give any insight into where this lies on the crank/hoax spectrum? A biorxv paper and a well-written blogpost don't really point either way.

When the author says things like: > But Katcher has no research grants or university lab or venture capital funding, no team of grad students mining databases and screening chemicals in the back room. > One thing Katcher has going for him is the correct theory. I start to suspect the author’s opinion is stronger than their evidence.

I'm not taking a stance on the topic, but I think that if you quote the part that you did, then you should also quote the part right before it, for full context:

> In the race to effect substantial, system-wide rejuvenation, Harold Katcher is a dark horse. He has the right academic credentials and a solid history of research. In fact, in earlier life he was part of a team that discovered the breast cancer gene, brca1. I asked Harold for a biographical sketch, and have printed it in a box at the end of this posting.

And here's the bio sketch itself:

> So, you might consider me a late bloomer. While I have thousands of citations in the literature, with publications ranging from the discovery of the human ‘breast cancer gene’, to protein structure, bacteriology, biotechnology, bioinformatics, and biochemistry, there was no center or direction to my work as I had given up my personal goal of solving/curing aging when I learned that ‘wear and tear’ was the cause of it. Yet something happened in year 1985 when I was in California working with Michael Waterman and Temple Smith (fathers of bioinformatics) that is inexplicable: I found myself in Intensive Care with a tube inserted into my trachea and the knowledge that I might not live. And then I had a dream: I dreamed that somehow in the far future (and on another world), I was being feted for ‘bringing immortality to mankind’. Clearly, I survived that incident (started with an infected tooth). I lived a wonderful life – becoming a computer programmer (which I loved), leaving that for the University of Maryland’s Asian division, becoming a full professor and then the Academic Director for the Sciences, in Tokyo, Japan. By the time I left Japan in 2004, (my daughter Sasha was a fourth-grader, (yonensei), in the Japanese school system), I was teaching for U of M online – somewhat retired, and looking forwards to writing computer programs for fun and profit. Yet I never ever forgot that dream. It was clearly impossible; I had no lab – and really, there was no way to repair all damaged cells – it’d be like sweeping back the ocean. And then, in 2009, I read an old paper from 2005, a paper written by the Conboys, (Michael and Irina), Tom Rando and others, coming from Irv Weisman’s lab, that completely changed my life; that showed me that everything I believed about aging was wrong – that aging occurred at the organismic level, not at the cellular level and could be reversed. Well, the rest of the story is about persistence and the blessed intervention of Akshay Sanghvi who too saw there was another way and provided the structural, monetary, and emotional support (and some good ideas) that had me start a new career at age 72 in Mumbai, India. I feel twenty years younger than I did three years ago, I guess that’s another hint about aging. Now the ‘mystical’ dream? It wouldn’t be the first time in history that that happened – take that as a datum.

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#119
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with not wanting to die?

Being dead is basically the equivalent experience as not having been born. I'm not terribly upset about all the things I missed before 1977 AD. Not sure why I should be too worried about what I'll miss when I'm gone.

I'm not as afraid of being dead as I am about the process of getting sick and dying.

Re: Age Reduction Breakthrough?

#120

Since it seems like the upshot of all of this is that Katcher is claiming to have discovered a set of signalling molecules which, when injected, rejuvenate tissue and presumably lengthen life, it runs into one of the most fundamental objections that can be leveled at theory of aging (or cure thereof): of the billions of humans that have existed, how is it that none of them have possessed a mutation which (in this cas…

Seems like having this mutation from the beginning might be very different from getting it when you're 20+. Would you simply fail to develop even to viable infant stage?
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