Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business • Hacker News Board

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#11

Post by gffrd » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:39 PM UTC

martythemaniak wrote: post #9

First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service, but that's going nowhere fast. Then they were going to be mobility service - cars, bikes, scooters, everything would go through them. But no more. So what are they going to be now? Just milk their taxi service until Waymo, Tesla or whoever comes and wipes them off the market? Honestly, what are their long-term prospects? I've been staying away…

This is what I want to know.

Ridesharing fares are obviously underpriced … and if they were raised 30% to make them sustainable, it becomes "not worth it" for a good chunk of people who use ridesharing as a supplement to car, bus, transit, etc.

I assume the strategy is a long-play to have people + communities become wholly dependent on your services (they skip buying cars, skip learning to drive, transit fails to evolve further), then once they are, ratchet up the prices? It's just that you have to clear that point first, otherwise :pile of burning cash emoji:

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#12

Post by Avshalom » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:46 PM UTC

martythemaniak wrote: post #9

First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service, but that's going nowhere fast. Then they were going to be mobility service - cars, bikes, scooters, everything would go through them. But no more. So what are they going to be now? Just milk their taxi service until Waymo, Tesla or whoever comes and wipes them off the market? Honestly, what are their long-term prospects? I've been staying away…

They were also going to be a global logistics/courier business.

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#13

Post by dylan604 » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:48 PM UTC

martythemaniak wrote: post #9

First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service, but that's going nowhere fast. Then they were going to be mobility service - cars, bikes, scooters, everything would go through them. But no more. So what are they going to be now? Just milk their taxi service until Waymo, Tesla or whoever comes and wipes them off the market? Honestly, what are their long-term prospects? I've been staying away…

The truth is now settling in that Uber was a dot bomb?

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#14

Post by subsubzero » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:49 PM UTC

gffrd wrote: post #11

martythemaniak wrote: post #9

First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service, but that's going nowhere fast. Then they were going to be mobility service - cars, bikes, scooters, everything would go through them. But no more. So what are they going to be now? Just milk their taxi service until Waymo, Tesla or whoever comes and wipes them off the market? Honestly, what are their long-term prospects? I've been staying away…

This is what I want to know. Ridesharing fares are obviously underpriced … and if they were raised 30% to make them sustainable, it becomes "not worth it" for a good chunk of people who use ridesharing as a supplement to car, bus, transit, etc. I assume the strategy is a long-play to have people + communities become wholly dependent on your services (they skip buying cars, skip learning to drive, transit fails to evo…

I think Uber is a lost cause, sorry to say but the food delivery business cannot be profitable for a majority of customers to where they will still pay for takeout. Their ATS service(self driving cars etc) was using stolen technology from waymo, now they are forced to using their own technologies they are way behind waymo, aurora, nuro, etc. Even ride hailing which is supposed to be their bread and butter is losing money, trying to up the ride costs and expect a huge drop in riders. Lastly Covid-19 joined the party, nobody wants to ride in a strangers car who could be infected (or visa-versa). This mindset of fear of the virus could take a year or so to subside, by then how much money will they have burnt?

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#15

Post by paulcole » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:51 PM UTC

martythemaniak wrote: post #9

First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service, but that's going nowhere fast. Then they were going to be mobility service - cars, bikes, scooters, everything would go through them. But no more. So what are they going to be now? Just milk their taxi service until Waymo, Tesla or whoever comes and wipes them off the market? Honestly, what are their long-term prospects? I've been staying away…

> First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service

Anyone who fell for this is a fool. Nobody could answer the question, “How is self-driving cheaper than exploiting human drivers like they are now?”

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#16

Post by redorb » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:54 PM UTC

criddell wrote: post #10

camjohnson26 wrote: post #3

I doubt many of Uber’s casual users understand how insanely unprofitable the current business model is. 2.9 billion is 3 unicorns. Even before COVID they’ve been losing something on the order of a billion a year. It’ll be interesting to see if they can turn this around.

What would qualify as a turn around? If three years from now they are a $50 million company that's profitable, would that work?

I don't think so. Being a 50mm company probably includes no longer serving the majority of markets they do now. At 50mm they become a regional taxi service with phone hailing rides.

Truth is - now that they are public ~ I'm not sure what success is... for a lot of people who started there a long time ago - the IPO was 'the success' now the public is left holding the bag (mostly by their own choice of buying the stock).

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#17

Post by xnx » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:54 PM UTC

gffrd wrote: post #11

martythemaniak wrote: post #9

First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service, but that's going nowhere fast. Then they were going to be mobility service - cars, bikes, scooters, everything would go through them. But no more. So what are they going to be now? Just milk their taxi service until Waymo, Tesla or whoever comes and wipes them off the market? Honestly, what are their long-term prospects? I've been staying away…

This is what I want to know. Ridesharing fares are obviously underpriced … and if they were raised 30% to make them sustainable, it becomes "not worth it" for a good chunk of people who use ridesharing as a supplement to car, bus, transit, etc. I assume the strategy is a long-play to have people + communities become wholly dependent on your services (they skip buying cars, skip learning to drive, transit fails to evo…

Even that monopoly-style strategy never made sense to me since the barrier to entry for a competitor to create a ride-coordination app is low (Lyft has made one, Google, certainly could) and the switching-cost to the end user is low (I have zero loyalty to Uber or Lyft).

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#18

Post by rossdavidh » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:55 PM UTC

eralps wrote: post #7

camjohnson26 wrote: post #3

I doubt many of Uber’s casual users understand how insanely unprofitable the current business model is. 2.9 billion is 3 unicorns. Even before COVID they’ve been losing something on the order of a billion a year. It’ll be interesting to see if they can turn this around.

I wonder what it takes to take down Uber and alike. These companies keep losing money but still going on. Is it possible that they pivot the whole business to Uber Eats only?

...or "pivot" to selling themselves to GM or Avis or some taxicab company, at pennies on the dollar?

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#19

Post by rossdavidh » Fri, May 08, 2020, 7:56 PM UTC

xiaolingxiao wrote: post #8

Could someone w/ an understanding of accounting add to this report? Uber is "offloading" bike/scooter business to Lime, but also making an investment in Lime... is this just a way to hide losses? Essentially paying Lime to take the red off Uber's balance sheet, while maintaining an option in the micromobility market?

IANAAccountant, but I think the investment was in the past, and this announcement is that they are ditching the investment. But I could be reading that wrong.

Re: Uber loses $2.9B, offloads bike and scooter business

#20

Post by ghaff » Fri, May 08, 2020, 8:01 PM UTC

gffrd wrote: post #11

martythemaniak wrote: post #9

First, they were gonna make the jump to be an autonomous robotaxi service, but that's going nowhere fast. Then they were going to be mobility service - cars, bikes, scooters, everything would go through them. But no more. So what are they going to be now? Just milk their taxi service until Waymo, Tesla or whoever comes and wipes them off the market? Honestly, what are their long-term prospects? I've been staying away…

This is what I want to know. Ridesharing fares are obviously underpriced … and if they were raised 30% to make them sustainable, it becomes "not worth it" for a good chunk of people who use ridesharing as a supplement to car, bus, transit, etc. I assume the strategy is a long-play to have people + communities become wholly dependent on your services (they skip buying cars, skip learning to drive, transit fails to evo…

>Ridesharing fares are obviously underpriced … and if they were raised 30% to make them sustainable, it becomes "not worth it" for a good chunk of people who use ridesharing as a supplement to car, bus, transit, etc.

Though right now seems like a pretty good time to raise prices to the degree that they haven't already. I suspect that for some time to come those who can afford to do so will pay a significant premium to avoid public transit.