Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce • Hacker News Board

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#231

Post by newhouseb » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:31 PM UTC

eganist wrote: post #68

ping_pong wrote: post #53

I'm shocked that 2020 revenues will come in only 50% below 2019. I don't think anyone will be travelling for the bulk of this year, especially with the looming threat of potentially getting sick in a foreign country or away from your home. It will take 5+ years for them to get back the same level of inventory/hosts/customers as they had in 2019. Many hosts will foreclose on their rented properties during 2020 or conv…

> I'm shocked that 2020 revenues will come in only 50% below 2019 This is a fair point, but it also suggests strongly that a significant minority of their business is month to month rentals, possibly in place of leasing. And hey, being frank, I wouldn't mind considering going somewhere else for a few months now that I can work remotely for a while.

I have no real data, but anecdotally a large number of my peer group (tech folks in NYC) fled the NY Metro Area in March. Those who had (not at-risk) family nearby stayed with family, while others (like myself and my partner) are quarantined in Airbnbs in more remote areas (although still close to a functioning medical system).

It's costing us an arm and a leg, but we've been very fortunate in that we can afford it. We normally live in a high-traffic apartment building with multiple dogs that require walks, so exposure seemed likely (and indeed a doorman later tested positive).

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#232

Post by saiya-jin » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:32 PM UTC

pb7 wrote: post #111

KoftaBob wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"In many countries, the severance pay is a lump sum that increases with the employee’s tenure in the company and their wage level. In the Czech Republic, Denmark, Hungary, Italy, Lithuania, Poland, Portugal, Slovakia and Spain, employees with service of up to one year are entitled to severance pay (in most cases one month’s pay), while in Luxembourg employees have to have a minimum of five years within the organisati…

It's not, people just love shitting on America. 14 weeks + 1 additional for each year served at US salaries + unemployment + paid health insurance for 12 months is extremely generous compared to the peanuts that Europe pays engineers.

What you describe here as generous is pretty standard in my part of Europe, things like health insurance or unemployment benefits aren't even a concern to worry about. In fact, when fired, my company normally gives 3 months PLUS 1 month per year worked. Now that's what I call generous.

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#233

Post by pb7 » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:33 PM UTC

Apocryphon wrote: post #214

pb7 wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't look like more to me. Roughly same salary duration (would bet a pretty penny that Kickstarter doesn't pay nearly as much as Airbnb to begin with), significantly less health insurance, nothing about equity. That's what a union came up with for such a microscopic layoff compared to Airbnb? Sounds like the free market is better off deciding these things.

Not sure how relevant Airbnb equity really is at this point going forward.

RSUs will always be worth something unless the company goes completely bankrupt. Judging by the stock prices of major hotel chains like Marriott and Hilton which serve as a rough guide, the equity is likely worth ~50% less now -- certainly not irrelevant considering the offers were always considered generous to begin with.

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#234

Post by dilyevsky » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:33 PM UTC

fapi1974 wrote: post #36

yojo wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m surprised they were still handing out options - don’t most later stage startups switch to RSUs? I’d hate to have to decide whether to exercise today, cliff or no cliff.

Does anyone recall if Airbnb were one of the firms to institute more employee-friendly exercise windows? If so that takes some of the pressure off the decision.

They are probably double trigger rsus with 10y expiration

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#235

Post by hyperbovine » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:33 PM UTC

capocannoniere wrote: post #58

lacker wrote: post #12

There are going to be a lot of tough decisions for people who have to decide whether to buy their Airbnb options or lose them. I bet a lot of people at Airbnb are wishing they went public before all this.

While Airbnb is clearly going through a rough patch right now, there is a clear bull-case argument for why Airbnb will emerge stronger than it's ever been after this: - Airbnb has sufficient cash in the bank to survive the crisis. - A significant % of hotels and budget chains will not survive the crisis --> decreased competitor supply - People will be looking for budget options when traveling --> increased demand for…

I honestly don't know what fraction of AirBnb's business still consists of indies renting out rooms to vacationers for short-term stays. But that market is simply hosed for the foreseeable future, if not forever. Complete lack of enthusiasm from guests and hosts alike. Driving strangers around in your car or having them stay in your home is never again going to seem like the great idea that it once did.

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#236

Post by hibikir » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:34 PM UTC

fennecfoxen wrote: post #32

yojo wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m surprised they were still handing out options - don’t most later stage startups switch to RSUs? I’d hate to have to decide whether to exercise today, cliff or no cliff.

I haven't seen RSUs outside of publicly traded companies.

Late stage startups have to offer RSUs, as the equivalent option package becomes extremely unattractive if you depart before the company is public.

Imagine, for example, an initial option grant of 180K shares at $2.00, which expire 90 days after you leave. Then fast forward two years: The valuations have doubled every year, and half are vested, so you have 90k options priced at $2, but that last valuation puts at $8 each. Sounds like you have a lot of potential money right? Maybe, but not if you leave. If the company isn't public, you either have to rely on some secondary market that might be really shady, or have to hold your shares until IPO. To do so, you need to spend $180K, and prepare for an AMT tax hit of, roughly, 28% of the gains. 90k shares, with $6 a a share paper gains, means $135k in taxes that year.

So barring that secondary market for the shares, we are talking about spending $300k exercising the options. Few people can, or are willing, to put that much money in, even if on paper they are up hundreds of thousands of dollars.

RSUs will demand action at IPO, as you can't delay the exercise forever, but it's far better than, in practice, letting a majority of options lapse, even when you are pretty sure they'll be deep in the money at IPO.

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#237

Post by hnxs » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:34 PM UTC

exogeny wrote: post #15

If any iOS engineers from Airbnb are in this thread and looking for what's next, happy to chat. Email in bio.

Guessing most of their iOS teams will stay intact, but who knows.

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#238

Post by mav3rick » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:35 PM UTC

jameslevy wrote: post #99

schkkd wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why when a yet another aspiring startup wants to hire me, I ask for a high sign on bonus as an insurance, monthly vesting cycle, at least 200k in base pay and high severance upon termination. Never been given that, but I don't regret: looking back, all those "just 1 year till IPO" companies are underwater.

Monthly vesting without a year one cliff is not really done, AFAIK. I also don't think that there is a lot of wiggle room for negotiated severance terms. But sign on bonuses and 200k base pay could certainly be on the table.

It happens at both F & G in FAANG.

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#239

Post by ThisIsTheWay » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:36 PM UTC

user5994461 wrote: post #207

dangwu wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell us why you think 7,500 employees is too high, in order to implement, maintain, and grow an online lodging and experiences marketplace in 191 countries.

hotels.com managed just fine with only 500 employees in their headquarters.

Provide a source for that 500 headcount... Hotels.com lists 1100-1500 employees depending on where you look, and LinkedIn shows ~1600 employed by Hotels.com today.

With that said, Hotels.com is owned by a multi-billion dollar conglomerate called Expedia, which employees ~24K people across multiple brands. AirBnB is operating on their own.

Re: Citing revenue declines, Airbnb cuts 25% of workforce

#240

Post by dilyevsky » Tue, May 05, 2020, 8:36 PM UTC

fennecfoxen wrote: post #32

yojo wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m surprised they were still handing out options - don’t most later stage startups switch to RSUs? I’d hate to have to decide whether to exercise today, cliff or no cliff.

I haven't seen RSUs outside of publicly traded companies.

Yet they are quite common in late stage pre-ipo companies bc few will take their options