Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 82 posts

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#71

Post by FlyMoreRockets »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #22
mindcrime wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think anybody is proposing to replace the entire existing food supply chain with nothing but hunted deer. There is no reason however, to think that hunting can't supplement a family's food stocks if other sources start to become thin. And there's a lot more to hunt than deer. There's also more in play than hunting. A family might feed themselves through a combination of any or all of: hunting, trapping, fishi…

Again, there is every reason to believe (know) hinting/foraging is woefully inadequate. Simple numbers. Natural 'foods' are pitiful fractions of modern cultivars. It takes a quarter acre(?) of Jerusalem Artichoke to gather a few baskets of roots, which must be boiled and peeled down to a few score pounds of edible material. Even a bonanza 10-acre plot in a meadow would feed 40 people for a few days. Early Americans s…

I have grown Jerusalem artichokes in my home garden a few times. Each plant easily produced two pounds of tubers before boiling and cleaning. Plant spacing of around 9 square feet per plant. That comes to over ten TONS per quarter acre. They are amazingly productive.

I highly recommend "How to Grow More Vegetables: Than You Ever Thought Possible on Less Land Than You Can Imagine" by John Jeavons.

Every year, my garden produces an ever increasing portion of the food for my household and this year it has expanded to provide a significant amount of food for a small flock of chickens. Important things that aid my productivity and reduce the time it takes are a heavy mulch to minimize weeds, improve soil fertility and reduce water consumption as wel as drip irrigation on timers.

There are plenty of people using sustainable techniques to produce more food than they can eat if you look around on the internet.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#72

Post by FlyMoreRockets »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #67
daxorid wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personal experience from someone who enjoys hunting and eating game: The bigger issue is getting one's family on board. A spouse or kids who have grown accustomed to CAFO beef and chicken and not much else will be difficult to transition to gamier meats, to say nothing of offal.

This is where the meat grinder swoops in to save the day. Venison doesn't always make the best steak but there's very few meats that don't make a good burger or taco.

And sausage, don't forget sausage.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#73

Post by JoeAltmaier »

mindcrime wrote: post #60
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Responded to the comment directly above (?) As a supplement to a family's food supply, hunting and foraging are totally insufficient. Not if everybody was doing it. The numbers aren't there. Fewer steps in the seafood supply chain, doesn't offset the fact that in America anyway, it currently provides a whopping total of 1 meal a week per. That's gotta be dropping too. So still the numbers don't support any idea of su…

As a supplement to a family's food supply, hunting and foraging are totally insufficient. You can't really make that claim without quantifying the degree of supplementation in question. And that's an unknown. So really this is all just speculation. But I can say that for myself, I'd rather have the ability/knowledge/skills to acquire food by hunting, trapping, foraging, fishing, etc. than not, all things being equal.…

Agreed.

If it comes to it, good luck out there hunting with all the amateurs who are hungry, unskilled and outnumber trained hunters 100:1.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#74

Post by Balgair »

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #5
ndespres wrote: post #2

I think a lot of these folks underestimate what it takes to hunt an elk, field dress it, bring it back to their vehicle, and put away 300 lbs of meat. Even if you borrow a gun as one person interviewed here would, you need a truck, knives, a bone saw, camouflage, maybe a tree stand, and a large freezer, among other things. It is reasonable to hunt for food, but it's not reasonable for your typical "hospital manager"…

It's also a good excuse to learn to hunt. Every single experienced hunter had their first hunt at some time. My family has hunted for generations and I have hunted for nearly a decade now. You are right, there is an elevated risk of accidents. But the experience of hunting is nothing like raising chickens. Staying out in the woods for days, becoming more and more tuned to the animals and environment around you. Feeli…

To echo this: Hunting is good for the animals.

I know, I know, that seems like an oxymoron, like jumbo-shrimp or old-news. But in the US at least, a lot of national parks are funded via hunting permits [0]. The same is true in many parts of Africa. Those photos you see of some rich person with an elephant or a 5 point buck? The permit to kill that animal cost a lot of money and the parks are very grateful to have the cash [0].

NPR had a good story on how conservation in part depends on hunters: https://www.npr.org/2018/03/20/593001800/decline-in-hunters-...

Yes, the issue of hunters/poachers is a very complicated one. But what the sportsmen take, generally, is less than what they give back.

[0] The funding of parks is very complex, but permits do play a large part, generally. Each park is unique though.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#75

Post by JoeAltmaier »

Balgair wrote: post #74
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also a good excuse to learn to hunt. Every single experienced hunter had their first hunt at some time. My family has hunted for generations and I have hunted for nearly a decade now. You are right, there is an elevated risk of accidents. But the experience of hunting is nothing like raising chickens. Staying out in the woods for days, becoming more and more tuned to the animals and environment around you. Feeli…

To echo this: Hunting is good for the animals. I know, I know, that seems like an oxymoron, like jumbo-shrimp or old-news. But in the US at least, a lot of national parks are funded via hunting permits [0]. The same is true in many parts of Africa. Those photos you see of some rich person with an elephant or a 5 point buck? The permit to kill that animal cost a lot of money and the parks are very grateful to have the…

In our state the conservation efforts, the DNR, everything comes from hunting and fishing licenses. So-called environmentalists who criticize hunting (at least here) are ironically doing little or nothing while the hunters are supporting the cause.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#76

Post by mindcrime »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #73
mindcrime wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a supplement to a family's food supply, hunting and foraging are totally insufficient. You can't really make that claim without quantifying the degree of supplementation in question. And that's an unknown. So really this is all just speculation. But I can say that for myself, I'd rather have the ability/knowledge/skills to acquire food by hunting, trapping, foraging, fishing, etc. than not, all things being equal.…

Agreed. If it comes to it, good luck out there hunting with all the amateurs who are hungry, unskilled and outnumber trained hunters 100:1.

Let's hope it doesn't come to it though. There's a reason I have a lot of dried beans and rice stored away... :-)

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#77

Post by stronglikedan »

z3ugma wrote: post #36

This pandemic is really bringing out the folly of concentration at the expense of all other business considerations. Sure, it makes food cheaper but at what cost? We deserve systems that are more resistant to shocks. We've allowed oligopolies to form in many industries, perhaps especially agribusiness. This has brought prices to rock bottom and commoditized living beings, putting pressure to further reduce prices. "A…

But meat is sooo good, and there's nothing else even close, that I'm willing to pay more for it. I'd rather see the supply chain issues worked on, even if it just means more expensive meat. Going meatless is like cutting of the nose to spite the face.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#78

Post by indymike »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #50
indymike wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It takes about 2-6 deer to provide meat for a family of four for a year. So, a single deer is about two months of meat. (a deer is 50-125lbs of meat... depending on species and size)

Not if that's all the calories you have - then it adds up to a week's nutrition. But sure, as a trivial additive for fun, deer can work for a tiny fraction of the population. My state of 3M had 100,000 deer harvested last year. That's deer for 3% of the population. One deer each. Not gonna put a dent in our food supply. That was my only point.

Meat is generally 1/4lbs - 1/3lbs serving per person, per meal. Venison is very comparable to chicken breast nutritionally. So lower in fat and lower calorie than beef.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#79

Post by makomk »

Reason077 wrote: post #33

It's strange that meat processing facilities in the US have been hard-hit by Covid-19. These are places that have strict hygine standards during normal times, with employees wearing gloves and face masks as a matter of course. So you'd think they wouldn't be somewhere that diseases would spread easily. This has also not been a significant issue in other countries hit by Covid-19, that I'm aware of. What is it about t…

It's not necessarily being spread within the plants themselves - I've seen claims that due to poor pay etc, a lot of the work is done by immigrants crammed multiple people to a room in shared housing, and we know from Singapore that's a really effective way of creating a major coronavirus outbreak.

Re: Facing meat shortages, some Americans turn to hunting during pandemic

#80

Post by horsawlarway »

efiecho wrote: post #66
horsawlarway wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other foods aren't unavailable though... They aren't hunting because they're starving, they're hunting because meat is harder to get, and it's a nice luxury that's also expensive. Couple that with reduced/no income and choosing to hunt isn't insane. I know a fair number of people in rural GA who will hunt one deer a year and freeze it, You get small servings of meat all season. It goes a long way... No one would seri…

> No one would seriously recommend an all meat diet. It will kill you. The Carnivore Diet is a real thing that is gaining popularity, if choosing between two extremes with veganism on the other side, I would much prefer an all meat diet.

They're still not recommending what the original commenter was - a diet based solely of lean venison.

The carnivore diet fits pretty well into the "high fat" category.

I just went and checked, and the following seems to be a fairly consistent outline of the diet

---

Red meat (beef, pork, lamb), with an emphasis on fattier cuts of meat to take in enough calories.

Other options include:

Organ meats Eggs Lard Bone marrow Butter Salt and pepper

---

Basically - A mix of protein and fat with fat constituting much of the calorie intake.

So yes, my comment should really read

>No one would seriously recommend an all LEAN meat diet. It will kill you.

but the poster was doing calorie calculations for pure lean venison. That's insanity.

Post reply on HN