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Bye, Amazon

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Re: Bye, Amazon

#411

Post by CalRobert »

marcus_holmes wrote: post #344
CalRobert wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the challenge with large mortgages and heath care requirements taking away people's moral agency. Maybe that's the idea.

Talking to US friends about jobs is always weird because they're so afraid of quitting/being fired, because their health insurance is tied to their jobs. This whole system conspires to make people afraid and subservient. Why you guys haven't replaced it with someone that actually frees you, is always a mystery to me.

Well, some of us emigrated. But after I became a parent I realized my boss suddenly had far more control over me because I had to fear homelessness for the kids, not just me.

Bought a house cash last year in an extremely low col area and honestly I think I might be _too_ uppity now. Find myself commenting how sad it is that people more senior than myself work on weekends (for the usual meaningless bs reasons). The freedom from having a roof over your head that is security for no loan, and affordable health insurance (about 200 eur a month for a family of 4), is amazing.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#412

Post by zelon88 »

supergeek133 wrote: post #324
stupidcar wrote: post #20

> At the end of the day, it’s all about power balances. The warehouse workers are weak and getting weaker... Whenever I speak to someone working in a "low-skilled" job, I'm always astonished and embarrassed by how different their work environment sounds to the kind of offices I work in. There seems to be a consistent theme of employees being treated with suspicion, condescension and outright hostility. This gets to t…

I think this is a two way street. If you've never been involved at a management or ownership level of a business that has "low pay" labor (e.g., food service, warehouse, retail sales). For every 2-3 decent workers there is one that just takes pure advantage of the environment (e.g., stealing product, stealing time, etc). Sometimes this occurs at great cost for a period of time before it is discovered. EDIT: This was…

> This makes companies take extreme policy measures...

Governing to the lowest denominator is just poor management.

> ...because the financial impact is so disproportionate...

For who? Bob "steals" an hour of overtime worth $25 but he's still in your facility at your disposal. God forbid...

> "If you pay me more I won't act like this"

This I agree with. You get what you pay for. Period.

> But depending on the business (e.g., a local pizza place) there is no affording that.

So why is it alright to allow a failing business who can't create value in the workforce is allowed (and enabled) to stay open so it can ruin more lives and create more misery? Surely there's a decent pizza place around the corner that's well managed, creates value for employees, and deserves the business. Instead we crutch along shitty businesses for no reason. Case in point, at a debate in 2016 a woman asked Bernie Sanders how she would continue to grow her business if she had to offer her employees health insurance. She would have to scrap plans to open a second location.

I'm sorry, but if your first location can't sustain itself and create a meaningful work environment maybe nobody needs that second location of yours. Get health coverage for your existing workforce before you go hiring more.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#413

Post by sadturnip »

AlexandrB wrote: post #250
enitihas wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is the mythical company treating their low-skill workers far better than Amazon? Does the rest of big tech even employ their non professionals directly? Which of big tech directly employ their janitors and treat them much better than Amazon warehouse workers? Which of big non tech company does this? >its refusal to pay tax. What do you even mean by this? Companies can't refuse to pay tax. They have to pay tax a…

> Which is the mythical company treating their low-skill workers far better than Amazon? That's an easy one: Costco. Do a cursory Google search and you'll generally find positive stories going back years. There's nothing "mythical" here, it's a matter of explicit policy difference between the two retailers.

Costco is an okay place to work however, As someone who worked for Costco in the past, i think i was getting barely $1.50 more than minimum wage (this was 2015).

Furthermore you have a ton of full time employees who will sing praises about the company. However part timers get shafted hard. Oh you can't work 3 days a week due to school, okay enjoy barely 8 hours a week. There were a lot of people there who had to work multiple jobs simply because they could not get enough hours.

Unless you are fully willing to commit to them it isn't a great place to work.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#414

Post by kerng »

Bezos in front of congress just got a lot more interesting. This is something that they will likely spend a lot of time on.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#415

Post by apexkid »

Amazon is every other on fire in media for poor working conditions but they don't care because stock buyers of Amazon don't care. They will continue to invest as long as their wealth grows. This is what true capitalism is.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#416

Post by thecampfire »

tom_mellior wrote: post #216

> Fast-forward to the Covid-19 era. Stories surfaced of unrest in Amazon warehouses, workers raising alarms about being uninformed, unprotected, and frightened. Official statements claimed every possible safety precaution was being taken. Then a worker organizing for better safety conditions was fired, and brutally insensitive remarks appeared in leaked executive meeting notes where the focus was on defending Amazon…

To be fair, he did say that AWS was quite different. When he started he wasn't a VP, and it looks like firing activists and Covid-19 triggered it, rather than regular working conditions in normal times.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#417

Post by WilliamEdward »

lawnchair_larry wrote: post #353
Miner49er wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that's not really the case. It doesn't matter if something is done on the basis of race or sex. If the end result hurts those groups disproportionately it's racist/sexist. I guess this just may be a difference in definitions, but I think when most people are talking about racism/sexism on a macro level, they are using this definition. You're right, the broader issue is worker's rights, but it's definitely worth p…

No, that is absurd. That is not what sexism and racism means.

Who cares? If a sex and a race are disproportionately negatively affected, it doesn't matter whether this is definitionally prejudiced or not.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#419

Post by yalogin »

mercury_craze wrote: post #81

Amazon is a great evil. It will not be remembered as a company that has had been a positive influence on the world but as a company that has treated its employees (both hourly and salaried) with contempt, driven independent stores out of business and refused to play on a level playing field both through its shady business practices or its refusal to pay tax. Well done to Tim Bray for acting according to his conscienc…

It's amazing that this is where it arrived. In its early days, the exact opposite was true. People loved Amazon because its going against the "big box stores". Movies were made romanticizing the downfall of the big box stores. Now Amazon became the villain. Similar thing is of course happening with Google.

Re: Bye, Amazon

#420

Post by TulliusCicero »

9nGQluzmnq3M wrote: post #194
btilly wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US laws on libel and defamation are shockingly good. Free speech is woven into our culture and the Constitution. This post is squarely in the center of what is meant to be protected. UK laws are so horrible that the USA passed a law that UK libel judgements are not enforceable here. See https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-10940211 for more. Canada is somewhere between the two. Incidentally the country with the worst libel la…

I'm pretty sure South Korea wins that contest: libel is a criminal offense and truth is not a sufficient defense. https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/fighting-for-jus...

> A growing number of alleged sex abusers are seeking to use legal actions of their own to force victims into silence or into dropping their accusations.

> Filing a report to police is not in itself grounds for a defamation action, but if a rape victim goes public with their allegations, a criminal complaint can be filed against them.

My God, that's horrifying.

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