Live data from Hacker News

Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

Post reply on HN

Print view View original

61–70 of 498 posts

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#61

Post by lostcolony » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:11 AM UTC

Gollapalli wrote: post #53

paypalcust83 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My great-grandfather was in the restaurant business back east, but my grandfather saw how unprofitable it was and became a mechanic rather than continue the family business. (He got fired once as a short-order chef in the 50's from a Howard Johnsons for cooking too well. ) Restaurants must relocate to cheaper areas like warehouses and shift to a delivery-first distribution model, which Uber, Lyft, and Google Express…

>Restaurants must relocate to cheaper areas like warehouses and shift to a delivery-first distribution model, which Uber, Lyft, and Google Express could help dispatch. It sucks from a customer-interaction perspective, but it's necessary. Other businesses like Pret in London were already using a hybrid centralized preparation with small, hyperlocal retail sales model. Yes. Let's just kill all community space. Great id…

Chain coffee houses are doing fine. And ever been to a McDonald's on a weekday morning? Community still has places, even if independent restaurants are likely going to reduce in number.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#62

Post by wozniacki » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:12 AM UTC

virtualritz wrote: post #41

Amazing. 11 USD for a döner! A döner is between 2.5 and 5.0 EUR in Berlin (roughly 2.75 to 5.5 USD). That's takeaway or eat in at a place with a few tables but w/o table service. Meraba, which uses high quality organic meat from the region, comparable to the quality of the protein stated in the article, asks 4.5 EUR. A whole plate is 10 EUR.[1] If order to your doorstep it's 6.5 EUR.[2] [1] https://www.top10berlin.de…

But isn't it cash-only at even most established joints in Germany much less mom and pop immigrant-run hole-in-the-walls? My friend tells me even vape shops that sell hundreds of dollars of gear are cash only.

We have plenty of those in our ethnic neighborhoods. Heck even some very successful joints like Rosamunde Sausage Grill in the Mission District (S.F.) were cash-only until a couple of years ago, when I last went there.

Most other places accept cards & thus have to factor that into the price of the offerings.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#63

Post by 8f2ab37a-ed6c » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:14 AM UTC

talentedcoin wrote: post #18

People love food, but eating out at restaurants to the extent that happens in the modern world is a historical aberration. It’s not just other restos you’re competing with but a home-cooked meal too. I get the sense from the tone taken here that this owner is going to be in trouble down the line. It’s good to be passionate but their objectivity is clouded. The restaurant with the really expensive donair is indeed lik…

That's a good point.

On a more philosophical level, are restaurants an essential good for society, or more of a luxury along the lines of upscale purses, limited-run sneakers, Rolex watches and Teslas?

I'm not going to argue that they shouldn't exist, but just like with fine mechanical watches, I don't imagine society will collapse without them as we switch to centralized food preparation with economies of scale and more home cooking.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#64

Post by threatofrain » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:16 AM UTC

monksy wrote: post #43

Tepix wrote: post #2

Döner for $11? I‘ve ever seen one sell for more than €5 and €3.50 seems to be an average price here.

A good doener+drink for $11 is a steal in chicago.

The donner featured here is $11 without the drink. With the drink maybe it's $18 after tax?

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#65

Post by pdonis » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:16 AM UTC

Gollapalli wrote: post #53

paypalcust83 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My great-grandfather was in the restaurant business back east, but my grandfather saw how unprofitable it was and became a mechanic rather than continue the family business. (He got fired once as a short-order chef in the 50's from a Howard Johnsons for cooking too well. ) Restaurants must relocate to cheaper areas like warehouses and shift to a delivery-first distribution model, which Uber, Lyft, and Google Express…

>Restaurants must relocate to cheaper areas like warehouses and shift to a delivery-first distribution model, which Uber, Lyft, and Google Express could help dispatch. It sucks from a customer-interaction perspective, but it's necessary. Other businesses like Pret in London were already using a hybrid centralized preparation with small, hyperlocal retail sales model. Yes. Let's just kill all community space. Great id…

> Let's just kill all community space.

It might be helpful to differentiate "community space" from "restaurant". Or perhaps to differentiate "restaurant that is primarily selling convenience", which is the kind the article seems to be describing, from "restaurant that is primarily selling a dining experience in a community space". I would expect margins on the latter type of restaurant to be significantly higher.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#66

Post by dralley » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:16 AM UTC

Gollapalli wrote: post #53

paypalcust83 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My great-grandfather was in the restaurant business back east, but my grandfather saw how unprofitable it was and became a mechanic rather than continue the family business. (He got fired once as a short-order chef in the 50's from a Howard Johnsons for cooking too well. ) Restaurants must relocate to cheaper areas like warehouses and shift to a delivery-first distribution model, which Uber, Lyft, and Google Express…

>Restaurants must relocate to cheaper areas like warehouses and shift to a delivery-first distribution model, which Uber, Lyft, and Google Express could help dispatch. It sucks from a customer-interaction perspective, but it's necessary. Other businesses like Pret in London were already using a hybrid centralized preparation with small, hyperlocal retail sales model. Yes. Let's just kill all community space. Great id…

Because it's so much easier to fundamentally change a huge and enduring societal institution (the concept of restaurants in trafficked places) than to re-adjust the expectations of the fucking landlords, which has never been dealt with before...

The hyperfocus on "disruption" you sometimes see in here is really... something.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#67

Post by golergka » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:17 AM UTC

By the way, wouldn't it be the best time ever to start a restoraunt immediately after things get to normal?

A lot of vacant real estate, cheap after-market equipment, desperate workforce, so you can get the best cooks and waiters for peanuts...

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#68

Post by christiansakai » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:18 AM UTC

In my opinion. In here (NYC), food quality compared to big cities in Asia (at least that's what I know, both from 3rd world countries Asia and 1st world countries Asia) are way better than here in NYC.

It is crazy how bad food quality in NYC for its price. It is so bad that I almost feel like there is a conspiracy between restaurants in the city that goes on like this:

restaurantA: "Hey you know, we can make good food" restaurantB: "Yes you are right, we can, but why should we? Why not just create mediocre food? If everyone of us are doing it, the customers don't have any other choice, yet we still charge them expensive price" restaurantA: "You are right, why don't I think of that? that's genius"

I just don't understand why in Asia food quality compared to its price are just much much better. At least for Asian food. Maybe I am bias because I am Asian and used to Asian food. But yes Asian food here in NYC also not great for its price.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#69

Post by Melting_Harps » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:20 AM UTC

kayfox wrote: post #38

1996 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He got fired once as a short-order chef in the 50's from a Howard Johnsons for cooking too well. Under which logic? The Baron Von Muchausen argument of demoralization?

Consistency is a big deal in restaurants because mismatched expectations drives bad experiences.

> Consistency is a big deal in restaurants because mismatched expectations drives bad experiences.

It could also be that the expo/chefs valued speed over anything else, I've never been or eaten at a Howards Johnoson's, but I can easily see it being an issue if you're trying to make an effort while being behind on a ton of tickets and management prioritizes volume over quality and it they're seen as the bottle neck.

I admit speed is not my strong point, but my presentation and knife skills are strong so I make up for it that way and I'm organized and clean--its what got me to work under a 3 star Michelin chef (total nightmare, he finally got fired a months after I left) despite focusing mainly on Farm to table concepts for most of my career.

But I've been judged negatively in other kitchens for playing to my strengths and believing/saying that speed comes with time--in the last place I proved that is the case and trained 4 people due to that philosophy/results.

But patience isn't exactly easily found in kitchens or tolerated amongst a bunch of fast talking, high-strung adrenaline/stress junkies which is what most chefs are, myself included.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#70

Post by duxup » Sat, May 02, 2020, 4:21 AM UTC

thinkingkong wrote: post #3

Restaurants are fucked but the underlying costs associated with real estate are insane. Where I live, treasured restaurants close at a regular cadence due to rent hikes. Nobody can afford to run a restaurant at the prices being charged here. The end result is a cocktail that is $25 or a pint thats $10. High real estate prices are essentially forcing every commercial space to become a chain restaurant unless they can…

Yeah I wonder about the real estate situation.

There is a retail development near me that sat largely empty for years. They kept it up and clean, but word was the prices were sky high. It still has a huge number of vacancies ... we're talking 5+ years after it was built.

Meanwhile other retail places had shops closing, word was the rent kept climbing.

I almost want to suggest that the local city come up with a concept that somehow would encourage actual occupancy. Granted that could be complex but it seems a real waste to have these spaces empty / taking up space with high rents where maybe some business could try to run if rents were lower...

It is a weird dynamic. It's like every spot is just waiting for a Chipotle or Noodles & Company or some small fitness fad / chain and if not that ... nothing.

Post reply on HN