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CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

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Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone verify that he actually has a "Jewish mother?"

Claiming to have a Jewish mother (and thus being considered Jewish by pretty much everyone else, regardless of how you self-identify) does it for me. You call yourself a Jew? You're welcome. There are way more people shunning their Jewish identity, but I've never met someone pretending to be Jewish.

I believe it does happen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binjamin_Wilkomirski is not clear whether the subject lied about being Jewish or simply lied about his upbringing, but I'd guess the latter.

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#272
post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony_murder_and_the_death_pe... . There are quite a few under-18 cases. Per the article: "No one was struck or killed in the shooting." So again, [citation needed] about people committing the "exact same" crime being on death row, given that the crime described in the article is far below the bar necessary to warrant capital punishment. > let me state that I find it incredible that m…

I wonder if you and the rest of these commenters extend the same amount of compassion to the hundreds of thousands of non violent people stuck in prison that you do to the multimillionaire CEO of a state surveillance company. Someone who literally got away with shooting up a place of worship. And if you do, great. Lets work towards fixing the mass incarceration problem in our country. That way, many more people can b…

> I wonder if you and the rest of these commenters extend the same amount of compassion to the hundreds of thousands of non violent people stuck in prison

Yes, I do, which is exactly why I'd much prefer we work against that issue instead of advocating for making the problem worse.

The American justice system has a chronic issue of prioritizing retribution over rehabilitation, and while I'm thankful to not have been a victim of that myself, I also recognize full well that I'm one of the lucky ones, and that millions of Americans (whether currently incarcerated, or having already "done the time" but still effectively-permanently handicapped from being productive members of society due to having a criminal record) are not so fortunate.

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#273
post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony_murder_and_the_death_pe... . There are quite a few under-18 cases. Per the article: "No one was struck or killed in the shooting." So again, [citation needed] about people committing the "exact same" crime being on death row, given that the crime described in the article is far below the bar necessary to warrant capital punishment. > let me state that I find it incredible that m…

> And let me state that I find it incredible that many people such as yourself believe that people (especially teenagers) can't be victims of indoctrination, can't possibly feel genuine remorse for their mistakes as teenagers, and must be deprived of their rights forever because of those mistakes. If you are going to continue to attack a complete straw man of my arguments, I’m not sure how productive continuing this…

> If you are going to continue to attack a complete straw man of my arguments

It would be a strawman if the arguments against which I'm arguing were of my construction, but they don't seem to be.

> Your entire argument is predicated on 1) Damien, at almost 18 years of age, having absolutely no culpability for his actions, and 2) that he has shown genuine remorse for his actions, despite receiving essentially no punishment for a premeditated murder attempt and having shown no signs of remorse until he was asked to comment on the story.

Meanwhile, your entire argument appears to be predicated on 1) Damien, at less than 18 years of age and therefore legally and (arguably) psychologically a child, was somehow a perfectly rational actor with unquestionable culpability for his actions and was perfectly able to resist manipulation (which began, mind you, at 15, if not earlier) by adults wanting to use him as a tool for their hateful agendas, and 2) that he should be considered guilty of continued antisemitic beliefs/associations until proven innocent.

I won't pretend to know what that says about your personal character projections, but your argument is visibly just as speculative. Neither of us have enough information to judge that aspect of his character. Unlike you, apparently, I prefer forgiveness and the presumption of innocence in the absence of evidence to the contrary.

That's not to say that I don't judge him for being complicit in other immoralities, though (namely: being a current perpetrator of and accomplice to an unethical and likely-Constitutionally-illegal surveillance state, and his own resulting perpetration of such a state's implicit guilt-until-proven-innocence attitude).

> I would encourage you to extend the same level of generosity and charitableness you seem to show Damien Patton to the next person who challenges your worldview.

Like I said: I don't care who he is or how successful he became after apparently turning his life around. I just care that he apparently turned his life around and stopped associating with violently-antisemitic groups. If you have evidence indicating that he did not, then by all means present it and I'll gladly reassess.

And this is a standard I apply to all humans universally (both in theory and - as I grow older and hopefully more mature - increasingly in practice). I haven't exactly kept my attitudes and beliefs and opinions around rehabilitation-over-retribution and its impact on recidivism much of a secret over the years, whether here on HN and elsewhere on the World Wide Web.

I've given the benefit of the doubt to people who have done worse, specifically because I have the self-awareness to understand that people can and do change on the scale of decades (I know I've changed a lot in just one).

> I’m not sure how productive continuing this chain will be.

Neither am I.

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#274
post #16

Ouch. I'm sure this will destroy him financially and his reputation, but what if he actually turned his life around and is completely ashamed of this past? I don't want to come off like I support his past whatsoever, because I don't, but I feel there's no forgiveness left in our society to give people like this a second chance. I guess I just believe people can change for the better and I want to encourage that more,…

This will likely have no effect on him or his career. We have white nationalists in all levels of public and private life, more or less out in the open, and almost nobody can do anything about it, and those who could, don’t care.

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#275
post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Claiming to have a Jewish mother (and thus being considered Jewish by pretty much everyone else, regardless of how you self-identify) does it for me. You call yourself a Jew? You're welcome. There are way more people shunning their Jewish identity, but I've never met someone pretending to be Jewish.

I believe it does happen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binjamin_Wilkomirski is not clear whether the subject lied about being Jewish or simply lied about his upbringing, but I'd guess the latter.

oops: I'd guess the former.

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#276
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a KKK recruiter and organizer can eventually renounce his past and go on to have a 50 year career as a legislator in DC, why can't this guy put his past behind him? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Byrd

Possible. Ultimately for Byrd, the voters decided. In this case, the market will decide.

Which market is that? He’s a powerful ceo. There’s no market for those, as such. The market can set prices for bread and orange juice, although that’s manipulated too, but it’s not like this guy was traded on some options market or something. He got the job by raising capital, knowing the right people, etc. not everything is a market.

Also, the products his company sells are not on offer to the public but to a small elite of powerful government and private officials, who definitely don’t care what the public thinks since all this can be shrouded in secrecy and ignored or denied.

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#277
post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the mods at HN believe that shaming people for past actions doesn't promote "intellectual curiosity" or some equally inane non-reason. Considering it was on the front page, now doesn't appear 4 pages deep just minutes later, a mod clearly nuked this.

"Clearly" is an interesting word to use for something that you've imagined. The submission was "nuked" by user flags and the software known as the flamewar detector or overheated discussion detector.

dang, does it ever make you feel sad that so many HN users will apparently defend Nazis, KKK members, and other white supremacists regardless of the circumstances or severity of their crimes? Like, do you ever kind of throw up your hands and wonder why you’re spending so much effort maintaining “civil discourse” as users cheerfully spout Stormfront forum talking points right in front of you?

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone verify that he actually has a "Jewish mother?"

Claiming to have a Jewish mother (and thus being considered Jewish by pretty much everyone else, regardless of how you self-identify) does it for me. You call yourself a Jew? You're welcome. There are way more people shunning their Jewish identity, but I've never met someone pretending to be Jewish.

I have met many people with organizations like "Jews for Jesus" and "Jewish Voice for Peace" who were not Jewish but claimed to be.

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the article: > On the evening of June 9, 1990 — a month before Patton turned 18 — Patton and a Klan leader took a semi-automatic TEC-9 pistol and drove to a synagogue in a Nashville suburb. With Patton at the wheel, the Ku Klux Klan member fired onto the synagogue, destroying a street-facing window and spraying bullets and shattered glass near the building’s administrative offices, which were next to that of the…

>>He would have been tried as an adult and put in jail for a long time. Do you have evidence for this allegation of systemic racism?

While I'm having trouble picking any sides on this topic, surely you're being sarcastic about this, right?

Re: CEO of Banjo admitted to being a Neo-Nazi skinhead in his youth

#280
post #218
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A CEO of a surveillance company clearly has not turned their life around.

I think that's a little bit of a strawman argument. Surveillance has its time and place, especially when used to deter crime or bring justice to really bad people out there. That's like saying Kevin Mitnick didn't turn his life around when he started consulting.

>especially when used to deter crime or bring justice to really bad people out there

At what point does the vague goal of "deter crime" start to infringe on privacy? We're already seeing this happen and it's a bullshit argument, frankly.

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