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YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

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Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#71
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It says right in the article: "...noted relevant comments regarding censorship that YouTube CEO Susan Wojcicki had recently made. "Anything that would go against World Health Organization recommendations would be a violation of our policy ... [removal] is another really important part of of our policy," Wojcicki reportedly said."

Why trust the WHO when they are being defunded in the first place? After mismanaging and trying to cover things up? Sounds like YouTube is blindly following the WHO. I am so sick of big tech and all the censorship, privacy invasion, etc. Wish there was more alternatives but everyone will flock to what’s popular... Wish I had the resources to start alternatives, maybe headquarters in Texas where I bet they have a more…

> Alex Jones, sure people disagree with him maybe Just some things or even everything he says but if you don’t agree with him, don’t watch his channel, don’t follow him

Alex Jones was successfully sued because of his videos and repeatedly warned. YouTube like any business has a right to legally protect themselves. If YT continues to host Jones's content they could be held legally liable. I'm no fan of YouTube but they're clearly in the right in Alex Jones's case.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#72

This edges a little close to state media. Of course it’s not the same, but if the guiding philosophy is ‘we cannot trust the public with certain information, for it’s own good’, then we’ve adopted whatever the hell they do in non-free countries. Very bad precedent, very Un-American. Edit: As an arrogant American, I forgot to consider that this might be a global Youtube policy.

One annoyance of being global is also when people refer to things being released or having occurred in Summer etc.

There are indeed two summers on this planet every year.

Also, when people write date examples with the day and month both being values <= 12... that is especially annoying

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you, logged in to upvote this. These docs are committing basic errors. 6.6% infected has to be wrong. That just shows we're not testing enough to see the true, much lower, number. It's also biased because we're not randomly sampling--instead we're testing people that are already showing symptoms. Then when that inflated number goes in the denominator, it makes it look like the fatality rate is much lower.

How can this not be intentional?

It very well could have been. As someone pointed out in another comment, these guys talk very strongly about how someones "opinions about the data" might change when they aren't getting a paycheck. These two guys co-own several urgent care clinics are and thus probably suffering due to Covid-19 shelter-in-place orders.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#74

This edges a little close to state media. Of course it’s not the same, but if the guiding philosophy is ‘we cannot trust the public with certain information, for it’s own good’, then we’ve adopted whatever the hell they do in non-free countries. Very bad precedent, very Un-American. Edit: As an arrogant American, I forgot to consider that this might be a global Youtube policy.

No, it edges closer to Youtube being a publisher that controls or curates the content that is available on their platform.

That’s like saying the MTA is some independent platform that New Yorkers can choose to use or not use. Another example would be saying cable companies that have a monopoly over your region (once upon a time) provide real choice to customers that want to switch.

Youtube is the de facto video platform that the masses use, so much so that Youtube finds it necessary to enact something like this.

To bring it back to your point - If we don’t like YouTube’s policies, we can’t just simply ignore Youtube and move on from it. How it controls things is a big deal, especially if it is similar to how non-free governments censor stuff. We have to be vigilant of this, it ain’t some niche video site.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Elon’s response since the beginning has been way off, “The coronavirus panic is dumb” (March 6). I guess he doesn’t want to learn from his mistakes. It’s somewhat incredible to see how the “just the flu” crowd doubled down on their views despite the failure of containment in NYC (and high death tolls overseas in the UK and elsewhere) making it clear how many more people would have died if their plan of just letting t…

I'm not really a fan of the idea that any person (or company) can be compelled to give a platform to someone (or something) they don't want to. Freedom of speech doesn't guarantee you a soapbox, and it certainly doesn't guarantee you the right to someone else's soapbox. It sounds like a strictly emotional argument to suggest that YouTube doesn't have the right to decide what is or isn't allowed on their platform, and…

You can criticize a company's behavior while recognizing it is their right to do what they are doing. We do it all the time with other industries. Critiques of hiring/firing decisions, environmental practices, poor customer service, bad products, etc.

It is not unreasonable to dislike the trend of a company named "YouTube" increasingly favoring large state-sponsored and corporate organizations both in hard policy and soft algorithms.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#76
post #26

Here's a useful twitter thread that talks about mistakes these doctors made: https://twitter.com/CT_Bergstrom/status/1254481543759683584?... > What they did was simple: they looked at the fraction of patients who tested positive for #COVID19 at the clinics they own. They found 340 out of 5213 tests were postive, about 6.6% > Then they assume the same fraction of the whole population are infected.

This is taken out of context. Those doctors were using aggregate testing and mortality statistics in New York and California and extrapolating. Sample sizes in the hundred of thousands. This Tweet is taking an anecdote about what they were seeing in their own practices out of context.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#77
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By that logic can they remove videos claiming masks are effective at protecting yourself and society from the virus? Because I seem to recall the WHO (or I think it was the CDC?) blatantly lying about the efficacy of masks in order to keep them available to health professionals. I think this underscores why I'm so uncomfortable with YouTube doing censorship (or anyone doing it). The official narrative is not always r…

My understanding has always been that good science is supposed to be falsifiable. If the new rules are science can only be dictated by authoritative institutions and cannot be publicly questioned, is it still science?

The primary issue is that "dictating" has been implemented with owning the channels and making bad decisions with the channels consensus process. The Internet needs to be reworked to get rid of these large corporations being able to own channels, but Hell if I know how to do it.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you, logged in to upvote this. These docs are committing basic errors. 6.6% infected has to be wrong. That just shows we're not testing enough to see the true, much lower, number. It's also biased because we're not randomly sampling--instead we're testing people that are already showing symptoms. Then when that inflated number goes in the denominator, it makes it look like the fatality rate is much lower.

How can this not be intentional?

Which part? Taking what these doctors actually said out of context?

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#79

One of the comments made in the video (referenced in the article as well) is "We always have between 37,000 and 60,000 deaths in the United States, every single year. No pandemic talk. No shelter in place. No shutting down businesses." Since early Feb we've seen ~54K deaths from Coronavirus alone (excluding influenza deaths) [0]. The argument that this is just part of the normal flu cycle doesn't make any sense. [0]…

And that's despite nearly nationwide shelter in place measures. If those hadn't been implemented, the toll could well be an order of magnitude higher.

Are infections and death tolls in the countries with much less restrictive measures an order of magnitude higher?

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#80

This is lazy reporting. It's not wrong, but there's no insight here. No critical assessment of the claims made in the video nor the Youtube T&C, just a few clickbaity excerpts and some reaction comments. Compare with this excellent piece by the CBC on a somewhat similar viral video in Canada: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/u-of-r-biology-p...

Is CBC known to question the position of Canadian government, especially the majority opinion there? They are a state-owned entity, as far as I know, but I'm not Canadian so I know little about how independently they operate.

Like the British BBC and the Australian ABC, (and more?), the CBC is at arms length from the currently serving government, and was setup intentionally to be independent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Broadcasting_Corporat...

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