HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
11–20 of 89 posts
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#12I'd like a more complete description of this. My first thought is "no it's not", because you are encoding a fixed-sized grid in the HTML, which is then the total extent of the program. While no real machine has an "infinite tape", I think requiring the tape be embedded in the program itself is strengthing things a little far.
Why is it stretching things a little far? Non-infinite tape is, as you noted, a limit on everything we consider turing complete: this is just running at a much higher level of abstraction than your computer. You could (if you were so inclined) create a physical machine with a grid of memory that behaved according to rules defined by CSS selectors. Just because this doesn't do direct memory access and behave like the computer or a traditional TM doesn't make it not a TM. (Or, at least, any less of a TM than the computer you're using.)
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#13As far as I remember is LaTeX (or TeX itself) touring complete, too. In the end, if you can simulate a turing machine (or another "equivalent" calculating "device") the language is itself turing complete. While not being a html/css wizard, by the amount of complex examples i saw you could do with only HTML/CSS3, I am not surprised that you can write a cellular automaton in it. edit: typo (personal hangup with touring…
Turing. Not 'touring'. Please, it was right up there in the headline.
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#14As far as I remember is LaTeX (or TeX itself) touring complete, too. In the end, if you can simulate a turing machine (or another "equivalent" calculating "device") the language is itself turing complete. While not being a html/css wizard, by the amount of complex examples i saw you could do with only HTML/CSS3, I am not surprised that you can write a cellular automaton in it. edit: typo (personal hangup with touring…
TeX is very Turing complete. As is Java sans semicolons, C macros, and many other things that probably shouldn't be. Right now, I'm trying to figure out what the minimum number of characters you need in Ruby is to make it Turing complete. I'm pretty sure that if you restrict yourself to under 12 characters, it's still possible.
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#15Way to steal my karma.... :) As the original author of this, I was going to put it into a much more presentable state before showing it off here. For those confused, here's a proper explanation. No real-world thing can actually be Turing complete (able to express basically any computation that we might want to perform of any size). That's because there are finitely many atoms in the universe, so we can only construct…
It works fine on Firefox 4.0b12 on Linux too. :-)
That version works much better than the one I tried on github! It's also much cooler.
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#16Way to steal my karma.... :) As the original author of this, I was going to put it into a much more presentable state before showing it off here. For those confused, here's a proper explanation. No real-world thing can actually be Turing complete (able to express basically any computation that we might want to perform of any size). That's because there are finitely many atoms in the universe, so we can only construct…
That's what happens when you put something on github! In fact, I bet you any money that someone has already taken the code and created a 16-bit logic unit INSIDE minecraft INSIDE your turing machine.
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#17As far as I remember is LaTeX (or TeX itself) touring complete, too. In the end, if you can simulate a turing machine (or another "equivalent" calculating "device") the language is itself turing complete. While not being a html/css wizard, by the amount of complex examples i saw you could do with only HTML/CSS3, I am not surprised that you can write a cellular automaton in it. edit: typo (personal hangup with touring…
TeX is very Turing complete. As is Java sans semicolons, C macros, and many other things that probably shouldn't be. Right now, I'm trying to figure out what the minimum number of characters you need in Ruby is to make it Turing complete. I'm pretty sure that if you restrict yourself to under 12 characters, it's still possible.
C macros are not Turing complete, they're a pushdown automaton.
C++ templates are.
Check out this IOCCC entry which does simulate a Turing machine, but only by having another script repeatedly run it.
Edit: Yes, I meant to copy the link, see mchouza's comment for the link.
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#18Way to steal my karma.... :) As the original author of this, I was going to put it into a much more presentable state before showing it off here. For those confused, here's a proper explanation. No real-world thing can actually be Turing complete (able to express basically any computation that we might want to perform of any size). That's because there are finitely many atoms in the universe, so we can only construct…
> No real-world thing can actually be Turing complete
But when you say Turing-complete, I assume something along the lines of "a programming language can be built on top of it and you can create interactive applications using such a programming language instead of javascript".
It seems like that's not the case at all.
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#19Way to steal my karma.... :) As the original author of this, I was going to put it into a much more presentable state before showing it off here. For those confused, here's a proper explanation. No real-world thing can actually be Turing complete (able to express basically any computation that we might want to perform of any size). That's because there are finitely many atoms in the universe, so we can only construct…
> No real-world thing can actually be Turing complete But when you say Turing-complete, I assume something along the lines of "a programming language can be built on top of it and you can create interactive applications using such a programming language instead of javascript". It seems like that's not the case at all.
Then you assumed a falsehood. Turing completeness is a mathematical concept that has nothing to do with interactive applications.
Re: HTML + CSS3 is Turing complete
#20Earlier quoted context omitted.
TeX is very Turing complete. As is Java sans semicolons, C macros, and many other things that probably shouldn't be. Right now, I'm trying to figure out what the minimum number of characters you need in Ruby is to make it Turing complete. I'm pretty sure that if you restrict yourself to under 12 characters, it's still possible.
C macros are not Turing complete, they're a pushdown automaton. C++ templates are. Check out this IOCCC entry which does simulate a Turing machine, but only by having another script repeatedly run it. Edit: Yes, I meant to copy the link, see mchouza's comment for the link.
Link: http://www.ioccc.org/2001/ (herrmann1 files)