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Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

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Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#121

Post by dv_dt »

MichaelApproved wrote: post #25

The solution isn't hoping the free market would solve this with a competing platform. The solution is to create regulations & laws that prevent this behavior. You're either a platform/retailer or you're a manufacturer. You don't get to be both because we see the perverse incentive that happens when it's allowed.

That's what India basically regulated with Amazon. i.e. a company can't sell proudts on their open-market platform from companies you have a stake in (or your own generics presumably?).

https://www.digitalcommerce360.com/2019/02/01/new-ecommerce-...

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#122

Post by mtone »

hanniabu wrote: post #66
MichaelApproved wrote: post #25

The solution isn't hoping the free market would solve this with a competing platform. The solution is to create regulations & laws that prevent this behavior. You're either a platform/retailer or you're a manufacturer. You don't get to be both because we see the perverse incentive that happens when it's allowed.

Wouldn't solve anything. They'd just split their company to be separate entities but still share all the information and operate as if nothing has changed.

Isn't that collusion?

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#123

Post by thoraway1010 »

whoisjuan wrote: post #17

Stating the obvious I guess. All retailers do this and create their own white-label brands to squeeze profit from well-performing categories. Target, for instance, is very upfront about it and they have like a gazillion white-label brands that compete in hundreds of categories, which makes it very gray for the customer. Does anyone really think that any retailer launches a competing product in a category without look…

This is totally false - the number of retailers who have testified before congress that they don't use seller data to compete against sellers - and then who go ahead and do just that is basically zero.

Additionally, most other retailers actually BUY the third parties products and take the risk of promoting and selling it. On Amazon third parties take the inventory and many other risks and may have to pay amazon to promote their product.

The story here is that amazon has testified it does not do something, has supposedly the "highest ethical principals" - yet goes ahead and does exactly that which it said it doesn't do.

Do that not matter to you from a trust / credibility perspective?

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#124

Post by Ididntdothis »

I am believing more and more that these big companies are really bad for the economy and size should be discouraged. In the short run they can be very efficient and create cheap products for consumers but this comes at the cost of killing innovation that may come from smaller players.

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#125

Post by baddox »

wpietri wrote: post #67
ses1984 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this case it's shitty to be a supplier but isn't this great for the consumer?

Definitely not. Consumers are best served when you have a bunch of relatively equal players competing for their business, and where success is rewarded financially. That gives everybody an incentive to focus on continuously getting better at serving the customer through R&D, etc. But if the reward for success is just having Amazon come in and hoover up the money you would have gotten by launching a knockoff, then sud…

> Consumers are best served when you have a bunch of relatively equal players competing for their business, and where success is rewarded financially.

That depends on the significance of economies of scale and barriers to entry in a particular market. The term “natural monopoly” (as it’s used in economics) refers to a particular market where, because of barriers to entry, the optimal number of firms is one. Two firms would not be able to produce their good for cheaper than one firm.

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#126

Post by leonardteo »

kharms wrote: post #98
chairmanwow1 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What really is the issue? That Amazon is leveraging its success to be successful? It's unfair that Amazon is able to see that a product category is doing well so it invests its own money into manufacturing a product to sell through its site? Do you really think that if Amazon couldn't use the data from its own site that it wouldn't procure it elsewhere? Before any product is developed there is extensive market resear…

>What really is the issue? That Amazon is leveraging its success to be successful? The issue is that over the long term, Amazon is lowering the ROI on innovating and taking risks in the consumer goods space. It's able to do this because of its dominance as a marketplace.

Where it gets grey is when stakeholders privately invest or start companies that sell on the platform. Amazon chose to do it upfront with Amazon Basics but there’s nothing stopping them from creating house brands/labels even at arms length to give the impression that it’s not Amazon.

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#127

Post by x86_64Ubuntu »

MichaelApproved wrote: post #25

The solution isn't hoping the free market would solve this with a competing platform. The solution is to create regulations & laws that prevent this behavior. You're either a platform/retailer or you're a manufacturer. You don't get to be both because we see the perverse incentive that happens when it's allowed.

How come we don't see this kind of angst with other store brand items. I can't imagine these comments being lobbed at Wal-Mart's Great Value, Costco's Kirkland Signature, or Bi-Lo's SE Grocers items.

And private label doesn't mean you have to manufacture anything at all. Sometimes, you will go to the company whose marketshare you are trying to take and they will manufacture the product for you.

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#128

Post by stcredzero »

whoisjuan wrote: post #17

Stating the obvious I guess. All retailers do this and create their own white-label brands to squeeze profit from well-performing categories. Target, for instance, is very upfront about it and they have like a gazillion white-label brands that compete in hundreds of categories, which makes it very gray for the customer. Does anyone really think that any retailer launches a competing product in a category without look…

Does anyone really think that any retailer launches a competing product in a category without looking at all their supplier data?

So, if cars are inevitably becoming computers with wheels, what's going to happen to insurance companies? The major weapon of underwriting is data, and a company like Tesla is going to have a huge advantage in data over external insurance companies.

Is it really a societal good for big companies to control all of this data, or should the data belong to the consumer/owner/user? I suspect it's the latter which gives people the most choice and freedom by fostering the most competition.

Re: Amazon scooped up data from its own sellers to launch competing products

#129

Post by malandrew »

whoisjuan wrote: post #17

Stating the obvious I guess. All retailers do this and create their own white-label brands to squeeze profit from well-performing categories. Target, for instance, is very upfront about it and they have like a gazillion white-label brands that compete in hundreds of categories, which makes it very gray for the customer. Does anyone really think that any retailer launches a competing product in a category without look…

Everyone is arguing as if Amazon is the only retailer here. Yes, they are a platform, but they are one of many.

In fact, many people here contradict their own argument by saying that they are forced to go to other websites or direct to the supplier. Stating as much is tantamount to admitting that the market is functioning correctly.

Amazon is great for some things and bad for other things. If it doesn’t meet your needs, go elsewhere instead of rewarding it with your business and then complaining that it’s too big and powerful because people like yourself keep rewarding it with your business.

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