Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why's that?
Been discussed here a bit. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2240081 Basically, the program offers a $40k grant, which goes a long way in a lower cost country like Chile. Also, they model after the usual incubator stuff for helping entrepreneurs out. Note that I said "best example I've ever seen of what a nation can do to try to attract entrepreneurs". That doesn't mean I think it's the best it could be, nor that I…
Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
31–40 of 91 posts
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#32As an American I see this as a problem for America. However, there is a big upside to this. The rest of the world gets some of its talent back, which will help it develop faster. There are over 1 billion people in India, for example. They deserve to be more than a call center or a place to outsource for the US.
I disagree. The rest of the world gets talent back at the cost of those talented individuals. You are one individual starting a startup and the government, the people, everybody is against you. You must own a strong corporation with R&D centers to be able to swim against that tide. It's not for individual entrepreneurs. I think this way because I have been through it and now closing down in my home country, moving to…
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#33I have stopped reading what Vivek writes. It almost feels like he's writing inflammatory articles just to keep his name in print. I came to this country (US) more than 20 years ago. The I.N.S. (Immigration and Naturalization Service) were as big dicks then as they are now. Nothing has changed. It's just plain old government bureaucracy; but in this instance, their clients can't vote either, so there's no fear of a ba…
>I came to this country (US) more than 20 years ago. The I.N.S. (Immigration and Naturalization Service) were as big dicks then as they are now. Okay... so...? Did you wait 10 years for a Green Card while in immigration limbo? Do you even know the difference between then and now? >And yet, despite the INS's dickitude, the country churns out startups like crazy. So enough is enough? Will more hurt, esp with 10% unempl…
First, that it's hard to take seriously the idea that inept immigration policies are creating a real threat to the US, because it's still so far ahead of the curve on entrepreneurship.
Secondly, that it's not a human tragedy that people are being forced by circumstances to leave the US, because those people are likely to start companies in their home countries. It would be a good thing for the world if there was more entrepeneurship everywhere, not just where there is the least friction to practicing it.
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#34I have stopped reading what Vivek writes. It almost feels like he's writing inflammatory articles just to keep his name in print. I came to this country (US) more than 20 years ago. The I.N.S. (Immigration and Naturalization Service) were as big dicks then as they are now. Nothing has changed. It's just plain old government bureaucracy; but in this instance, their clients can't vote either, so there's no fear of a ba…
>I came to this country (US) more than 20 years ago. The I.N.S. (Immigration and Naturalization Service) were as big dicks then as they are now. Okay... so...? Did you wait 10 years for a Green Card while in immigration limbo? Do you even know the difference between then and now? >And yet, despite the INS's dickitude, the country churns out startups like crazy. So enough is enough? Will more hurt, esp with 10% unempl…
I waited 11 years, if it makes you feel better. And yes, I do know the difference between then and now. And you know why it's worse now? Because the demand is much higher! So, despite the INS's dickitude and the so-called "broken" immigration policies, MORE people are wanting to come here.
> So enough is enough? Will more hurt, esp with 10% unemployment? Maybe we should shutdown some VCs as well, since there are enough startups.
You need to comprehend before responding. The immigration system was as broken 20 years ago as it is today. During boom times it's broken; during bust times it is broken. During the dot-com boom, it was broken, and yet the dot-com boom still happened. It is a constant; you just route around it.
> Your argument doesn't make sense. According to you the US/Silicon Valley is the best place to breed startups.. but you want the potential founders to go elsewhere where they might not have the best chances. Does not compute.
It "does not compute" because you're not reading, just responding. I'm not saying that the founders should "go somewhere else". I'm saying that if they do choose to "go somewhere else", then that is not a bad thing; in fact, it has a lot of positive aspects to it. SV will be just fine.
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#35Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#36Yet another Vivek Wadhwa story with his same pet theme. Here is my question: is there any Vivek Wadhwa story on this issue in which he shows detailed figures for NET immigration flows into and out of the United States in comparison to countries like China and India? Or does he consistently do as I have seen him do here and in other stories, relating individual anecdotes and asserting the existence of a problem (too f…
It isn't about US vs. India immigration. It is about US immigration vs. the cost/effort of starting up a company in India (by an Indian citizen). No one's competing at this point to make it easier for "young people from African countries... to emigrate to those other countries". The low-hanging fruit is people of Indian/Chinese/whatever origin returning to their homeland and starting up the next big thing there, inst…
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
>I came to this country (US) more than 20 years ago. The I.N.S. (Immigration and Naturalization Service) were as big dicks then as they are now. Okay... so...? Did you wait 10 years for a Green Card while in immigration limbo? Do you even know the difference between then and now? >And yet, despite the INS's dickitude, the country churns out startups like crazy. So enough is enough? Will more hurt, esp with 10% unempl…
He's saying two things: First, that it's hard to take seriously the idea that inept immigration policies are creating a real threat to the US, because it's still so far ahead of the curve on entrepreneurship. Secondly, that it's not a human tragedy that people are being forced by circumstances to leave the US, because those people are likely to start companies in their home countries. It would be a good thing for the…
Restrictions on a work visa holder:
1) Your spouse cannot work at all unless she qualifies and obtains a specialized H1 herself/himself 2) If you get fired on a Friday, you're technically out of status from a legal point from Saturday and must leave immediately regardless of spouse,rent leases, homes, cars, pets, kids, kids' schools, personal property etc. 3) You and your spouse and kids cannot have any supplemental active income. This rules out selling photographs on stock photo sites, phone apps, etc. You can basically do nothing productive that earns money outside your job. 4) If you move to a different job or even change roles, you have to reapply for the Green Card process from the scratch. Expect multiyear delays just to get back to where you were. 5) If you or your spouse wants to visit your home country or travel outside the country, expect to get stuck there for months for no good reasons. It has become so bad that immigration lawyers are advising not to travel internationally except for emergencies. You're basically stuck in the country.
See one example:
Consulate Location - MUMBAI Interview Date - 26 AUGUST 2010 Docs asked? - None Docs submitted? None Docs submitted Date - N/A Email Receipt Date - NOV 23, 2010 Passport Submission Date - same day as that of interview Passport Stamped/Received Date - RECEIVED WITHOUT STAMPING AFTER 15 DAYS
RECEIVED 2ND EMAIL ON DEC 15, 2010 TO SUBMIT PASSPORT
AGAIN RECEIVED MY PASSPORT WITHOUT STAMPING
Waiting Since (in calendar days) - 170 DAYS
Petition Details:
Employer Type - AMERICAN , NON PROFIT ORGANIZATION Employer Size - more than 5,000 Assignment Type - DIRECT I-797 Approval Date - 01-JULY 2010
6) Processing of applications takes forever. You can be stuck without a driving license(no renewal) in some states while your extension is pending. Imagine having to go to work with no driving license. Paying an extra $1225 in no-delay fees can speed up the process in a few cases.
Edit:
7) Taxes: You get to pay all the taxes including Social Security and Medicare(employers also have to match this) and state unemployment taxes(one won't see a cent of this because one is supposed to leave as soon as they're unemployed).
There was a recent bill that increased the fee of some type of work visa applications by $2000 to fund... wait for it... the Mexican border security!
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#38"I was one of the first to outsource software development to Russia in the early '90s. I was one of the first to use H-1B visas to bring workers to the U.S.A.," Wadhwa says. "Why did I do that? Because it was cheaper."
from here:
http://www.cio.co.uk/article/527/the-next-wave-of-globalisat...
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#39This is true not just for SV but also the biotech/pharma R&D sector. I personally know people who have already moved out of the US to places like Singapore and India, and are doing way better in terms of peace-of-mind, moving ahead with their lives, having kids, putting down roots etc. On the other hand, I know a few others who are much like nomads within the US, moving from job to job just to keep their H1-B visa st…
I personally know people who have already moved out of the US to places like Singapore and India May I ask some follow-up questions to make sure I understand your point of view on this issue? Are you referring to people who are originally from Singapore or India, or to people from third countries who settle in Singapore or India rather than settling in the United States? How does the number of those persons compare t…
Indeed, why would anyone leave their home for new laws, different language, different foods, different social customs.
The very same reason both my great grandfathers left Ireland to come to America, opportunity, and a better way of life!
Our family are all US born citizens. I am a registered republican, highly educated, and have founded 2 successful companies in Silicon Valley, and now a third in Vienna, Austria. Our family left the United States 9 years ago. We will not return until the US is once again a land of opportunity.
I am a proud American. I am proud of my country,and it's citizens. I am not proud of the kleptocracy that the State and Federal governments have become. I saw the financial industry collapse and "great recession" as inevitable back in 2002 when we left.
Yes the immigration system in Austria is highly dysfunctional and just as self defeating to entrepreneurs as in America.
Attractions:
Austria has a highly effective social welfare system, social health insurance system, career training, apprenticeships, and no cost higher educational system. As a direct result, Viennese society is one of the safest on the face of the earth. Kindergarten children take the subway and streetcars to school by themselves.
The European Union actively funds "open source development", and requires much of its research to be made open source. Software patents in Europe, which exist, are unenforceable. The US government sells its research to the highest bidder, depriving its citizens of its use. Europe believes in returning its research to its citizens use.
Austria, Germany Switzerland, and France are growing rapidly, and have record low unemployment rates. Austria is currently at 4.6 percent.
Vienna has been the top Mercer world city for 2 years in a row. A very trusting society, papers are placed in plastic satchels, with a coin box attached. The subway and train systems have no entry / exit barriers or gates. A simple ticket stamping machine sits on a post. In a highly trusting society, there is no need for steel newspaper boxes or oppressive barriers.
Austrian's are protected by law from overwork, and as a result, are very healthy, utilizing far less heathcare services than the typical American.
Austria, Germany, and France are the best countries for an American to emigrate to.
Vivek Wadhwa fails to realize that immigrant founders actually deprive Americans of key jobs. Founders jobs. Immigrants are the only people desperate enough to accept the immoral yet legal terms offered by many Vulture Capitalists. A legal form of slavery. Nothing else explains the high percentage of immigrant founders adequately. I was witness to several immigrants having lost control of their own companies just as they became profitable.
The US must actively recruit each and every foreign born entrepreneur, engineer and scientist they can find, in order to grow the economy to at least 7 percent a year, or it will be bankrupt before 2025.
By throwing wide the doors to foreign immigration, the Vulture Capitalists would be unable to exploit foreign immigrants. The playing field for both immigrant and US citizen would be equal. The US would, within a few years, drastically reverse its trade deficit to a significant surplus. Just as Austria, Germany, and France currently enjoy.
I don't see that happening, and so the US government will be deprived of vital tax revenue from the next great technological advance. US corporations have parked 2 trillion dollars of profits overseas, to avoid paying US taxes.
I highly recommend US citizens act with haste to emigrate to a new home in either Europe or Asia before the Hobsian society arrives in force, resulting in an exodus tidal wave of Americans.
Re: Why Silicon Valley Immigrant Entrepreneurs Are Returning Home
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
>I came to this country (US) more than 20 years ago. The I.N.S. (Immigration and Naturalization Service) were as big dicks then as they are now. Okay... so...? Did you wait 10 years for a Green Card while in immigration limbo? Do you even know the difference between then and now? >And yet, despite the INS's dickitude, the country churns out startups like crazy. So enough is enough? Will more hurt, esp with 10% unempl…
> Okay... so...? Did you wait 10 years for a Green Card while in immigration limbo? Do you even know the difference between then and now? I waited 11 years, if it makes you feel better. And yes, I do know the difference between then and now. And you know why it's worse now? Because the demand is much higher! So, despite the INS's dickitude and the so-called "broken" immigration policies, MORE people are wanting to co…
>You need to comprehend before responding. The immigration system was as broken 20 years ago as it is today. During boom times it's broken; during bust times it is broken. During the dot-com boom, it was broken, and yet the dot-com boom still happened. It is a constant; you just route around it.
Were startups so easy to found 20 years ago? Were there mobile apps that one can develop in part time?
Vivek is trying to lobby for a better future. Just because people used to walk uphill both ways in snow to school in the past then doesn't mean you shouldn't try to fix it atleast now.