Live data from Hacker News

Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

bloomberg.com

61–70 of 546 posts

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#61

Does this not make the case for investing in renewables over shale extraction and fracking that has a price floor below which it's not economical?

Generally an increase in oil prices is considered an argument for more renewable investment. You're saying that a decrease in price is too. Is there any oil price movement that doesn't argue for more renewables to you? How about no change, is that a case for more renewable investment?

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#62

Note that this is for the May contract, which closes tomorrow, and anyone left with a contract then will have to actually take delivery of the physical product. Since we are in supercontango (oil storage is full, causing spot prices to be significantly lower than forward prices), I am guessing that traders who are still holding on to contracts and don’t have available storage have to unload contracts pretty quickly.…

Would they take delivery or would they pay the producers to dump it in the dirt or ocean? Oops into the ocean is cheap storage of useless oil.

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#64
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saudi Arabia is trying to build tourism? From where?

Dubai is definitely a tourist destination for a small number of hyper-wealthy people. The tourists get to be in the part of the bubble that serves alcohol.

Dubai is certainly a tourist destination but it's not in Saudi Arabia.

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#65

Does this not make the case for investing in renewables over shale extraction and fracking that has a price floor below which it's not economical?

> Does this not make the case for investing in renewables over shale extraction and fracking that has a price floor below which it's not economical?

Basically everything has a price floor below which it's not economical.

The real risk to oil right now is that the combination of low demand and low prices make it unusually attractive for governments to implement a carbon tax, which would also provide funding for the sort of stimulus they're looking for right now, without having constituents upset over high gas prices. The "carbon tax + dividend" thing does exactly that. And would have a meaningful effect even if it was only done by e.g. US blue states and western Europe (which represent a disproportionate amount of world oil consumption).

In which case the demand for oil would never recover.

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#66
post #21
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nature has figured it out. (I.e.: the simplest way of storing oil is to not extract it.)

Once an oil well is producing the operators can't necessarily just turn it off. If they do cap it that can impair future production.

> If they do cap it that can impair future production.

Great! Let's get started.

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#67
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gold bars are already in the US, as part of the Nixon-Faisal agreements. That should not be a comfort to the Saud kleptocracy, as the Shah of Iran discovered.

Does the Saudi kleptocracy have any reason to distrust the US klpetocracy? After 9/11/2001 the US was quite loyal in a difficulty time.

The Saud were still in power. If they lost power, all bets are off. It’s certainly not their sterling moral character that gets them so many free passes today.

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#69

Does this not make the case for investing in renewables over shale extraction and fracking that has a price floor below which it's not economical?

Different industries, different people. Saudi needs a higher price to pay for their country than frackers in ND and TX need to make a profit regardless of actual extraction cost. We were going to have a drop in price just because of the global slowdown.

Frankly, we need to get to the next generation of nuclear because renewables will not be enough.

Re: Oil plunges below zero for first time with May contract ending

#70

Usually by the time you see commodities activity hitting the front page of HN the bets are in and the market is about to take a wild swing in the other direction. It is very easy to side with the news on oil right now that there is a historical over supply (so much so we have no place to store it any longer, and even considering paying producers to leave it in the ground) and we have a historical drop in demand...so…

In the near term, Fed buying oil for future delivery and instructing drillers to keep it in the ground.

In the longer term, the bankruptcies and capex cuts going on every day in the space--a lagging supply constrictor. Should be fuel to propel WTI to 80s when people start flying and driving again.

Post reply on HN