Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie • Hacker News Board

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#301

Post by momotomo » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:28 PM UTC

jpr wrote: post #50

momotomo wrote: post #7

I get the logic and intent behind these kind of articles but at the same time they infuriate me, because this is the kind of crap that people read and use as yet-another-reason as to why they don't try to get fit. Sure, machines aren't perfect, and they railroad your form, but it's better than nothing. I train on machines, _and_ with free weight, _and_ doing bodyweight / crossfit stuff. They all have their place. The…

> this is the kind of crap that people read and use as yet-another-reason as to why they don't try to get fit. I wonder if we read the same article?

Well I took the /print off the link because it kept crashing chrome, but apart from that we probably did. I'm talking about non-motivated, non-pro kind of people (see other response, I was 310 pounds and happily googling super fitness techniques while smashing cheeseburgers all night).

Overweight people don't need any reason to not turn up a gym or think they know better. Anything that provides benefit is better than nothing. If the entry barrier is signing up to a gym and having a trainer run you through a program, that's pretty low.

If it's finding obscure training venues with hardcore types and being broken down as a weakling (which yeah, works better than anything out there, and it's what I sign up for these days), then people won't touch it with a hundred foot pole.

Most uber-chunkers already feel like shit day in day out without coming up against further entry barriers or reams of information. Just find the closest venue or activity that will make you sweat and do it.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#302

Post by momotomo » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:31 PM UTC

sliverstorm wrote: post #19

Hyphen-ated wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd be almost guaranteed to fail the lift. Smith machines let you use higher weight because you don't have to spend energy stabilizing the barbell. With safety bars failing isn't a huge deal, it's just pointless.

Oh, he's talking about raw numbers. I guess in retrospect, that's obvious, but when I replied I thought he was saying he doesn't push himself as hard with free weights.

Yeah, can see how it read lol. There's no cage, just a smith machine at my local gym (and there's only two in town), so I do freeweight squats at home, then smith there, going for the max on each.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#303

Post by georgieporgie » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:33 PM UTC

jquery wrote: post #289

georgieporgie wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, but I have congenital ankle problems which make standing or walking for long periods (or just the wrong movements over a short period) problematic. My life is a balancing act of pain risk. :-) I find that maintaining the posture that my 8th grade typing teacher enforced is solving all of my neck issues. It's just difficult to maintain awareness of posture when I'm concentrating really deeply on a bit of code or d…

Ah, I'm sorry to hear that. Keeping your posture when sitting helps a lot too, but I understand it is hard when you're deep in thought.

How about with a stand-up desk? Do you find yourself slacking off with regards to posture? Of course, it may not be a problem for you regardless, if your issues were more related to, say, lower back pain.

Incidentally, my sister, who is obese, wants to take your plan one step further by going to the treadmill desk. I'm told that there is no problem interacting with stationary desk items after a period of adjustment.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#304

Post by rdouble » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:37 PM UTC

momotomo wrote: post #7

I get the logic and intent behind these kind of articles but at the same time they infuriate me, because this is the kind of crap that people read and use as yet-another-reason as to why they don't try to get fit. Sure, machines aren't perfect, and they railroad your form, but it's better than nothing. I train on machines, _and_ with free weight, _and_ doing bodyweight / crossfit stuff. They all have their place. The…

Smith machines are especially bad for squats because they will let you put up more weight than your back can really support. Same with the other squat replacement machines like hip sleds. Eventually, you will either crush your discs in the machine itself, or doing a regular squat with too much weight.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#305

Post by xiaoma » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:40 PM UTC

scotty79 wrote: post #295

xiaoma wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a ridiculous straw man. Yes, running will make running easier for you. That's great if you play sports. But sports aren't the only time people might get winded. It may be more common here in Asia where people aren't as reliant on cars but I, for example, have to about 20 minutes of walking and several flights of stairs involved in my daily commute. So do most of the other people I see in the subway. I've moved…

Do you feel fit because you can effortlessly deal with few flights of stairs and 20 minute walk daily? How old are you? I go out of my house about once a week and I can do that. I don't think running 5km is necessary to achieve it since maximum distance I ran in my life was 1km and after that I was spitting my lungs for longer time than I actually ran.

Quite the opposite. I'm only in my 30's, but I no longer feel fit as I once was back when I could run a 33 minute 10k.

Even long after leaving serious training behind and getting a bit heavier, I continued to go for a 3-4 hour run in the mountains every other week or so and did shorter runs at least a couple of times a week. As recently as two years ago, I had a resting pulse of 48 BPM. I lived at the top of a 6 floor apartment building. Unlike my guests, I was rarely winded at the top, even going up the stairs with a backpack. I even played pick-up games of basketball in the park after pub crawls with my buddies. It felt like my energy was boundless.

My habits changed after moving to Beijing. The air here isn't so good, so I don't enjoy running anymore. Instead, I've been going to the gym and doing something very similar to what the article recommended, actually! I'm stronger than ever before, squatting about 170kg. I'm not fitter, though. I'm fatter. My resting pulse is up to 70 and while the subway is no problem, several flights of stairs are off-putting. A full-court game of basketball would probably make me feel ill.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#306

Post by bmelton » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:47 PM UTC

yummyfajitas wrote: post #254

btilly wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you say is perfectly logical, but subtly flawed when it comes to the USA. If you're poor, odds are that you're eating fast food. The primary cost of fast food is not the cost of the raw ingredients, it is the time and effort to make the fast food. Furthermore many of the customers there see large portions as a value. Therefore fast food places have found it worth their while to offer large portions at a low pric…

A Big Mac has 540 calories, fries are 380. The cost difference between 2500 calories and 3420 calories is the cost of a Big Mac and fries. McD's portions are big, but they aren't 3500 calories big. This isn't about finishing your portions. It's about not ordering and eating an extra meal. You might be right if the only meals available had 1750 calories. In that case, your only choices are 1 meal (underfed) or 2 meals…

Your argument is sound, but overlooks that most people don't consume their entire daily caloric intake in a single meal. If I have a Big Mac, Fries and a medium soda, I'm almost certainly overfeeding myself for that meal.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#307

Post by duncanj » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:55 PM UTC

reason wrote: post #151

dalore wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with your statement about dying in a short period of time if you catch malaria. I grew up in a country with a high malaria rate (Papua New Guinea). I caught malaria several times and didn't die. Malaria is a curable disease, all though it is evolving against the current cures.

It's definitely curable. My hypothetical was based on the assumption that treatment was not given to show that we actually have not evolved defenses against the virus.

It's not a virus, it's a protozoan parasite, Plasmodium falciparum.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#308

Post by sedachv » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 10:58 PM UTC

tjogin wrote: post #233

yummyfajitas wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about pullups? The big three you mention don't seem to hit your upper back, biceps or shoulders much. (I'm a novice, genuinely curious.)

They're great, better than the complimentary ones I listed, but not strictly necessary if you do the Big Three. The areas you mention are covered by the dead lifts, especially shoulders and upper back. The bicep is a relatively tiny muscle that we tend to over train because of its "reputation" so to speak, but at a beginner to intermediate level, it really does get enough from just the dead lifts. You might want to r…

If you are using your biceps at all when deadlifting you are doing it wrong and will eventually tear one of them.

The thing to do to build biceps without doing curls are pulling motions - rows and pullups.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#309

Post by yummyfajitas » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 11:17 PM UTC

bmelton wrote: post #306

yummyfajitas wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Big Mac has 540 calories, fries are 380. The cost difference between 2500 calories and 3420 calories is the cost of a Big Mac and fries. McD's portions are big, but they aren't 3500 calories big. This isn't about finishing your portions. It's about not ordering and eating an extra meal. You might be right if the only meals available had 1750 calories. In that case, your only choices are 1 meal (underfed) or 2 meals…

Your argument is sound, but overlooks that most people don't consume their entire daily caloric intake in a single meal. If I have a Big Mac, Fries and a medium soda, I'm almost certainly overfeeding myself for that meal.

Here is a 3 meal/day McDiet with a beverage at every meal.

Breakfast: Egg McMuffin (300 cals), Hash Browns (150 cals) and Coffee (0 cals).

Lunch: McChicken (360 cals), Fries (380 cals) and Coca Cola (210).

Dinner: Big Mac (540), Premium Southwest Salad with Chicken (320 cals), and Coca Cola (210).

2470 cals/day.

To become obese, you need to add this:

Afternoon Tea: Sweet Tea (150 cals) and McRib Sandwich (500 cals).

Desert: Hot Fudge Sundae (330 cals).

Now you are up to 3450 cals/day.

There is nothing about being poor which compels you to spend money on the McRib Sandwich, sweet tea and the Hot Fudge Sundae.

http://www.mcdonalds.com/us/en/food.html

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#310

Post by yummyfajitas » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 11:27 PM UTC

jdminhbg wrote: post #284

yummyfajitas wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure you read the sentence you're responding to: "typically just increases their appetite." If you add exercise to a person's lifestyle without adding calories, they will lose weight. It's that simple. There is research to show this. I cited some of it. your discovery of his 'incredible dishonesty' doesn't pass the smell test -- surely someone eating 7.5 extra strips of bacon per day would notice? Go read Gar…

"If you add exercise to a person's lifestyle without adding calories, they will lose weight. It's that simple. There is research to show this. I cited some of it." That's great. There is also research that shows that acceleration due to gravity at sea level is 9.8 m/s^2, but that has little to do with what the OP said, which is that "exercise tends to increase people's appetites." You're refuting something he never c…

You're refuting something he never claimed.

From the original post: "There is no significant research that shows adding exercise to an overweight person's lifestyle will significantly reduce their weight - typically just increases their appetite."

I'm guessing because that's not the case?

If you take as given the cals in/cals out model (as Taubes does, in an attempt to refute it via reducto ad absurdum), they do.