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Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

lowtechmagazine.com

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Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#21

Post by goda90 »

sunsure wrote: post #15

This retire engineer in Nebraska has nice setup. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4O3ifR-3zvs

I wonder if these kinds of designs can handle smaller scales. I'd love to have such a greenhouse on my 0.3 acre lot in Wisconsin.

Edit: I found this guy's store page[0]. This is what they say about size: "Greenhouse in the Snow kits are priced by the lineal foot and are available in 6' increments beginning at 30'. The greenhouses are 17' wide. Most kits we sell are 78' to 102' long. Greenhouses less than 60' long are less cost effective than bigger greenhouses."

I imagine smaller greenhouses like this are still possible though.

[0]https://greenhouseinthesnow.com/shop

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#22

Post by tathougies »

dharma1 wrote: post #13

I grow a few things in a (relatively small) suburban garden in London. My experience so far with fruit normally associated with warmer climates: Grapes - grow very well outside, lots of tasty fruit, sensitive to mildew Figs - grow well outside, fast, but not much fruit yet Citrus (lemon, lime and kafir lime) - Any frost is damaging, can only grow in pots and bring in during winter. Grows slowly and doesn't produce mu…

The Europeans also used 'fruit walls'. I'm thinking of setting up one in Portland. Basically a brick wall that you espalier a fruit tree to. You redirect your chimney floo or hot water pipes through the wall to keep it warmer than the surroundings in the winter. I'm hoping to be able to grow frost-sensitive hardy citrus.

https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2015/12/fruit-walls-urban-fa...

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#23

Post by dh-g »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #14
allannienhuis wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

food security in times of disaster or emergency are other good reasons for investing in local food supply. Also, diversification of the economy. But ya, it needs to make some economic sense too. We grow a lot of food in hothouses in Canada...

I would love to see the math of geothermal greenhouses powered by renewables versus the carbon footprint of air freight of food. As renewables drive down the cost of electricity, the economics continually shift towards local production versus import. Outside of Alberta, most of Canada's electrical generation is very low carbon (nuclear and hydro) per electricitymap.org.

NS, NB, NT, SK are all pretty dirty - https://energyrates.ca/the-main-electricity-sources-in-canad...

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#24

Post by saltcured »

goda90 wrote: post #21
sunsure wrote: post #15

This retire engineer in Nebraska has nice setup. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4O3ifR-3zvs

I wonder if these kinds of designs can handle smaller scales. I'd love to have such a greenhouse on my 0.3 acre lot in Wisconsin. Edit: I found this guy's store page[0]. This is what they say about size: "Greenhouse in the Snow kits are priced by the lineal foot and are available in 6' increments beginning at 30'. The greenhouses are 17' wide. Most kits we sell are 78' to 102' long. Greenhouses less than 60' long are…

Bear in mind that the ratio of the exterior surface to the volume of the controlled space gets worse and worse as you make it smaller. And that this ratio is what helps make it cost effective not just in material costs but in operating costs, since heat transfer is across that surface...

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#26

Post by VBprogrammer »

artificialLimbs wrote: post #6

Super awesome! I imagine that most of the time, you don't even need to dig giant trenches, though. Sepp Holzer grows citrus in the freezing alps above ground. Their average temp is 5C. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GMXqgQIU9c

Sepp Holzer's farm is amazing. I think however it's unlikely that he's truly able to grow citrus fruit at scale even using all of his near magical techniques. Where he is able to grow citrus fruit is taking advantage of very small micro climates with ponds buffering temperatures and acting to reflect evening sun along with perfect orientation etc.

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#27

Post by jungletime »

The most hardy citrus is the ornamental Flying Dragon Citrus, which produces fruit, but the fruit is poor tasting. But can be grown in zone 6 Niagara Falls

http://www.eattheweeds.com/hardy-orange/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold-hardy_citrus

The most tropical fruit that can be grown in cold climates in North America is the Paw Paw. (Survives -30 degrees)

"It belongs to the genus Asimina in the same plant family (the Annonaceae) as the custard-apple, cherimoya, sweetsop, ylang-ylang and soursop."

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#28

Post by Spooky23 »

derefr wrote: post #11

I’ve often thought about the fact that most food into places like Barrow, Alaska is flown in, and wondered whether it would be practical to set up local infrastructure like this to grow food locally (with “practical” meaning “the CapEx of doing so would be repaid in logistical OpEx saved over a small number of years.”)

Forget about Point Barrow. I live in Upstate NY, one of the best Apple growing regions in the world. I’m eating an Apple grown in Chile while local orchards collapse.

Food has more to do with capital and commerce than anything else. The inefficiencies of consolidated global scale distribution require squeezing every penny on the production side.

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#29

Post by Scoundreller »

paypalcust83 wrote: post #7

Climate-controlled cultivation will likely become a necessity for food production as climate change intensifies. Spain, South Africa, many Middle Eastern and other countries are already heavily reliant on greenhouses. Also given that megadroughts, floods, and hurricanes are likely to be the new normal, sufficient capacities of solar-powered desalination will be important to sustain food production levels. My main imm…

Problem is that greenhouses are the most laborious. Can’t drive a tractor through to plant and pick everything.

Re: Fruit Trenches: Cultivating Subtropical Plants in Freezing Temperatures

#30

Post by hirundo »

"Training small citrus plants was key to extending their cultivation across all regions of the Black Sea coast, where until then it had been impossible. This was achieved by pruning and guiding citrus plants into a creeping form, which reduced their height to a mere 25 cm."

People complain about cubicle farms, but there's so much we can do to train workers to be productive in them, if we start them young enough.

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