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Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

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Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#21

Post by sod »

dfsegoat wrote: post #8

Not a doctor. But I am seeing growing evidence that ventilators are overused potentially. From ref [1]: > But as doctors learn more about treating Covid-19, and question old dogma about blood oxygen and the need for ventilators, they might be able to substitute simpler and more widely available devices. and > "In a small study last week in Annals of Intensive Care, physicians who treated Covid-19 patients at two hosp…

That's what I heard as well from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Dwcfye7_LQ

Maybe not overused, but wrongly applied. He cites a doctor from new york in the video and two sources in the video description.

Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#22

Post by bhartzer »

Jailbreaking the CPAP machine might not be necessary. From what I understand, a CPAP, in certain circumstances, can be given to someone who has 'milder' COVID-19 symptoms. That would then free up a ventilator so the vent can go to someone who has more severe symptoms.

Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#23

Post by favorited »

The CPAP jailbreak community was eye-opening when I first learned of it. I never expected something like that, but with the draconian policies it's not surprising.

For example, my CPAP has a CDMA radio inside, which transmits usage data back to the manufacturer & my doctor. Insurance won't pay for it unless the machine tells them I'm using it – so a medical device company has a record of when I sleep and wake, which is mildly unnerving.

Edit: I think sleepyhead[0] was the biggest project when I started looking into it, but it isn't under active development anymore. Apparently forked to OSCAR[1].

[0]https://gitlab.com/sleepyhead/sleepyhead-code

[1]https://gitlab.com/pholy/OSCAR-code

Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#24

Post by rootusrootus »

dimgl wrote: post #2

This is very cool. I was wondering the other day if my CPAP machine (same model) would be capable of doubling as a ventilator and I'm surprised that someone has already thought of this and provided a solution.

I've got exactly that model as well. There are probably 10s of millions of them in use in the US. Really cool to see someone hack them, but I can't say that I will be doing that with mine :).

Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#25

Post by CydeWeys »

takk309 wrote: post #14
jon_elbrook wrote: post #9

ventilators don't just pump air. they also monitor and control the amount of air, and beep when something is wrong. plus a bunch of other features...

Exactly, I would not like being hooked up to a machine that could overinflate my lungs without sounding any alarms.

Well good thing a CPAP won't do that to you then, for obvious reasons.

Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#26

Post by gvjddbnvdrbv »

schuetze wrote: post #12
dontparticipate wrote: post #6

Messing with vents if you don't know what you're doing sounds like a sure fire way to kill yourself.

Agreed. BiPaP to ventilator already seemed like a somewhat questionable transformation, and now we're going CPAP ----questionable software hackery ----> BiPaP --- questionable hardware hacking ---> Ventilator This is hubris. Ventilators are not iPhones circa 2010. It's irresponsible for non-medical researchers to not only pursue, but also disseminate, these jailbreaks. A significant portion of medical device RnD is r…

This is a real adaptation being used by real doctors in real hospitals to save real people's lives. There is a pandemic on.

Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#28

Post by jauer »

schuetze wrote: post #12
dontparticipate wrote: post #6

Messing with vents if you don't know what you're doing sounds like a sure fire way to kill yourself.

Agreed. BiPaP to ventilator already seemed like a somewhat questionable transformation, and now we're going CPAP ----questionable software hackery ----> BiPaP --- questionable hardware hacking ---> Ventilator This is hubris. Ventilators are not iPhones circa 2010. It's irresponsible for non-medical researchers to not only pursue, but also disseminate, these jailbreaks. A significant portion of medical device RnD is r…

> it's irresponsible for non-medical researchers to not only pursue, but also disseminate, these jailbreaks. A good portion of medical device RnD is related to creating technology that is hard to misuse and result in accidental death, and I just don't see that here.

This is simply wrong, both from a user perspective and a general research perspective.

Positioning a jailbreak like this as a solution to general vent shortage may be irresponsible if it leads to people trying to treat others instead of relying on doctors, but going beyond that is ignoring the good that's come from work like this.

Hacked up and jailbroken insulin pumps have been a thing for years, often to get increased safety over what manufacturers can provide: https://medium.com/neodotlife/dana-lewis-open-aps-hack-artif...

There's also a history of people unlocking and altering settings in CPAP/BiPAP devices in response to data (many providers treat them as set and forget devices and don't bother reviewing logs except for initial patient compliance).

Beyond people hacking their own devices, we've seen that security of medical devices wouldn't improve without independent researchers highlighting the flaws and driving them to fix them: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/17/security-researchers-say-the... and https://www.darkreading.com/vulnerabilities---threats/lethal...

Re: Airbreak.dev: Jailbreak your CPAP machine to turn them into ventilators

#29

Post by fortran77 »

tcbawo wrote: post #3

Not a doctor. A major issue with using this type of CPAP machine on a Covid-19 positive person is the high amount of aerosolized virus particles it exhausts. Anyone using this should be extremely careful and know what they're doing. That being said, doctors in many countries are using positive air pressure machines with an air-tight helmet/bag with filtered exhaust.

What's scary is that CPAP machines are allowed on airplanes. If they really aerosolize virus particles, maybe they shouldn't be.
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