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Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

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Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#171

Post by monocasa »

duskwuff wrote: post #68
izacus wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This standard way doesn't work in corp environments (which WebEx and Zoom are targeting primarily), where machines are remotely provisioned. For decent macOS remote installs and updates you need the PKG format scripts.

And the wacky PKG files used by Zoom (until recently) and WebEx are likely to be incompatible with those provisioning methods, because they don't unpack their contents and finish installing normally.

They work just fine with the remote via Jamf or what have you.

Deprovisionig might not work right, but that's rarely needed.

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#172

Post by jpambrun »

jeromegv wrote: post #106
jpambrun wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The app store is disabled on my work mac where I am most likely to need zoom/WebEx.

So your company prevents you from downloading vetted apps from the AppStore but will let you install random apps downloaded on the internet? Well that’s a good one!

Most folks can't install anyting at all. Dev can request admin rights. I don't make the rules..

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#173

Post by CGamesPlay »

lonelappde wrote: post #155
CGamesPlay wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, Apple has rectified this flaw by writing the Mac App Store, where applications can't pull these shenanigans and are properly sandboxed from one another.

Why is the store relevant to sandboxing ?

They only allow sandboxed apps to be placed on the store.

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#174

Post by monadic2 »

m463 wrote: post #77
monadic2 wrote: post #15

Why do these apps require installers at all? What are they installing—presumably any of their proprietary tech can run in userspace unprivileged. Personally, my best guess is because that’s the flow the product manager expected.

It's because they have specific strategic things they want to do. As an example, I noticed the Docker installer starts off doing telemetry before anything has been installed. Other less nefarious uses are to ask about telemetry / GDPR before installation. Apple documentation on installers specifically says -- you don't even have to have an installer. And most software really doesn't.

> Other less nefarious uses are to ask about telemetry / GDPR before installation.

I’d imagine you’d want to gate this through the process itself to ensure users have actually accepted, especially as EULA enforceability varies from place to place.

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#176

Post by nathancahill »

lonelappde wrote: post #154
nathancahill wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even worse when they don't copy it off the DMG. Just leave the DMG mounted.. forever.

That's good. It's called a portable app and it reduces pollution of your environment. It's a simple partial implementation of something like Docker.

All fine and dandy until they accidentally eject the DMG and can't figure out where their browser went.

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#177

Post by philtar »

duxup wrote: post #160
lonelappde wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no fundamental technical reason why apps can't run as their own users (like apache and postgres have done for 20 years) and and use something like oauth to control sharing data with other apps. Just laziness.

I'm kinda lost on the comparison between postgres and... web applications?

He's comparing postgres to normal desktop application.

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#178

Post by _8j50 »

Yeah and if webex suddenly got popular like zoom,it too will be massacared.

This stuff is common. You know how many populat windows software acts bad? Filezilla's installer for example would literally install a very nasty strain of adware (to their credit, they give you the option to opt-out)

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#179

Post by mr_toad »

Avery3R wrote: post #41
figbert wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mind throwing me the name of or link to the program you used to unpack the .app? I'd like to do that myself, and remember stumbling on a program that did that, but can't recall the name.

7-Zip can do it on windows, maybe there's an osx port?

brew install p7zip

Re: Tell HN: Cisco WebEx on OS X uses the same pre-installer tricks as Zoom

#180

Post by noahtallen »

ThePowerOfFuet wrote: post #101
x0x0 wrote: post #2

Everyone who's spent 3 hours talking a parent through downloading and installing a Zoom client understands exactly why they're doing this. Mine are unable to (1) reliably download a zip file; (2) navigate to that file using Finder; (3) run something inside it. By the time we were done -- I use copilot (basically VNC with NAT punching built in) -- and I got control of the laptop to just do it myself, there were 7 down…

The problem is that you don't even need this; use a conferencing solution that works in the browser, such as Whereby. It even works in Safari on an iPhone (!!!!!!).

zoom works in the browser, iirc
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