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Apple Faceshield

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Re: Apple Faceshield

#591

Post by logarhythmic »

mxcrossb wrote: post #435
rumanator wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is currently a global pandemic afoot that is spread by droplets expelled from people's mouth and nose. Do you have any source on how face shields are an effective tool against atomized covid19 viruses? The general guidance is that facial masks are effective at barring infected people from emitting contaminated particles, but not good at stopping healthy people from having contact with the virus. Therefore why…

I hear mask promoters say the “it’s to protect others from you” line, only to turn around and say “masks are obviously useful, that’s why doctors wear them.” The truth is, mask use is built on incredibly shaky evidence, so it’s no surprise that now face shields will become part of the hype. Both may indeed be useful, but without a clear model of effectiveness, it’s hard to make good assessments.

I thought the entire point of wearing a mask was precisely because we don't have clear evidence as to it's effectiveness. With such a degree of uncertainty (we are literally in the midst of an epidemic) it's not very practical to wait around for perfect information and evidence before you act

Re: Apple Faceshield

#592

Post by janekm »

raverbashing wrote: post #574
futhey wrote: post #518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're donating a million face shields by the end of the week to hospitals and medical facilities with the greatest need, and 20m by the end of the month, designed by Apple and sourced via their existing supply chain.

A writeup of how that was accomplished (because it seems it was a new design, or maybe an adapted design) would be very interesting. Did they adapt an existing cutting tool? New tool? What were those factories making before the pandemic?

The cutting tools (dies) for cutting flat sheets like this can be made in literally one day by the type of factories that Apple works with (less if you're in a real hurry). I visited a cardboard packaging factory near Shenzhen before; They use a combination of a CNC router to cut out slots in the die base plate and a CNC folding machine to pre-fold the cutting angles into the cutting blades. Smaller hole / lozenge shape cutters are sourced in as pre-fabricated components.

The design is very smart from a manufacturability point of view, I expect we will see other factories making similar face shields in the 100s of millions shortly. Which is great... One of our local supermarkets is already using similar face shields for their customer-facing staff.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#593

Post by pmachinery »

mbreese wrote: post #429
BalinKing wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the recommendations by many countries to wear even cloth masks (e.g. the recent reversal by the CDC) _because_ there's a good chance COVID-19 can spread via large (i.e. non-aerosolized) respiratory droplets? (Not that it doesn't also spread in other ways, but removing even one vector would be better in this case than not doing so.)

I'm not sure why there is a recommendation to wear cloth masks in other countries (not discounting it, I just haven't looked). However, I believe that the primary rationale for the CDC switching their recommendation that everyone should wear masks has to do with the great numbers of asymptomatic carriers. In this scenario, wearing a mask is not designed to protect the wearer from others. Wearing an ill-fitting mask i…

>https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/04/should-you-wear-a-fa...

> This may lead some members of the public to be lax about ... washing their hands frequently and thoroughly. Moreover, donning [a] mask may lead some people to touch their faces more, some argued.

> simply touching their mask could contaminate their hands if there are viral particles caught on the outside ... a mask wearer could then transfer virus particles from their mask to their face

"May". "May". "Some argued". "Could". "If". "Could".

> negating any benefit of having the mask.

So even with all the above steps that have to occur, it's still no worse than getting a face-full of Covid directly.

Almost every stupid, pointless, dangerous argument against masks boils down to:

People may not wear a mask properly. People may not wash their hands properly.

The first one is used as an argument against masks, so why is the second not only not used as an argument against hand washing, but also used in arguments against masks?

People don't always practice social distancing. So why don't people argue against that? Oh, because that too is reserved for arguments against masks.

It's fucking ridiculous. Why do some people continue to spend so much time and effort trying to discourage use of potentially life-saving items?

Re: Apple Faceshield

#595

Post by psteinweber »

adamqureshi wrote: post #594

Anyone one know if they open sourced the design spec? I'd like to make a few with some people i know. Thank you.

I don't know. But someone posted this in a previous comment, maybe it helps:

> The Czech 3D Printer company Prusa has been on it for a while: https://www.prusa3d.com/covid19/ and they have been open-sourcing the design. You can print it on a 3D printer.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#597

Post by adamqureshi »

geomark wrote: post #491
woofie11 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was hoping everyone in the US might be able to buy one. Ideally, they'd be cheap enough for municipalities to buy and distribute.

Make your own. Transparency sheet with corners cut rounded, foam strip cut from a sponge stuck along one edge of the sheet with double sided tape, elastic strap stapled to two corners. Easy and effective. We have been making and donating them to hopsitals and first responders in our area (not in the US) who are happy to get them.

Do you know where i could download a design spec ? I know a guy who wants to take a crack it making a face shield.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#598

Post by valuearb »

arized wrote: post #353
cheez wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be more concerned about Chinese suppliers who have privately said they would supply faulty equipment related to corona virus to the US.

Really? I would consider unchallenged, systemic slavery to be a fairly important problem. Not something to be dismissed as less concerning than another critical issue. I am just surprised by the complete lack of news. How many people do we think would choose not to buy a smartphone made in China this year, if they knew the supply chain used slavery. Sadly, I don't think people care - as long as they get the latest iP…

If you care about slave labor, buying Apple would be one of your mitigations. They have extensive outside review of their supply chain practices, reported on regularly.

Your risks are more smaller companies that the media hasn’t put through the ringer. And Samsung, which got caught using prison labor.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#599

Post by arvindch »

harimau777 wrote: post #577
neuronic wrote: post #567

Earlier quoted context omitted.

COVID-19 is very likely only marginally spread by aerosols (I take this from Robert Koch Institute, Germany information [1]), approximately 10% by contact spread and mainly by direct transmission of droplets. Faceshield therefore protects from the main transmission vector. It's not impossible to get infected otherwise, simply much less likely. Your main enemy are getting coughed/sneezed/talked at in close proximity.…

So this is likely a dumb idea, but if things got truly desperate I wonder if a snorkel mask would be a decent improvised protection. Your eyes and nose would be completely covered and your mouth is getting air from a direction/location that is unlikely to be in the "line of fire" from someone coughing or sneezing.

They already are, actually: European researchers retrofit snorkel masks for coronavirus fight - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-czech-...
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