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The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

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Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#21

Post by DanBC »

s9w wrote: post #15
mmmmmyumyum wrote: post #11

How do you know that this was the cause of death when all we know is that these people were tested positive on Covid19 before they died? Not denying that Covid19 is a thing and measures are necessary but I think this question is valid when reading such headlines.

A positive test is not even necessary to report them as Covid-19 deaths in the US. > Should “COVID-19” be reported on the death certificate only with a confirmed test? > COVID-19 should be reported on the death certificate for all decedents where the disease caused or is assumed to have caused or contributed to death. https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/coronavirus/Alert-2-New-I...

> A positive test is not even necessary to report them as Covid-19 deaths in the US.

But this applies to other forms of death. We count flu deaths in the same way, so the data is equally skewed.

> > > COVID-19 should be reported on the death certificate for all decedents where the disease caused or is assumed to have caused or contributed to death.

People can only put it on the death certificate if they can make that assumption to the best of their knowledge or belief. It's not doctors guessing.

Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#22

Post by loriverkutya »

artemonster wrote: post #3

I don't understand how to deal with deniers anymore. I've tried sharing a lot of explanations/articles/videos to the "tis just a flu, bro" crowd from my friends and this convinced nobody. I guess showing even this fact/statistic would do nothing too. Is there a cure or a method to convert such dense crowd? (well, besides bashing their heads with something heavy)

Some people does not seems to have any other type of learning skill on some topics.

Let them learn from their own experience or let them see it with their own eyes. There is a theory that anti-vacc is on the rise, because people does not know anybody who suffered from the grave consequences of the diseases which we have vaccines to prevent.

The same probably applies to the COVID-19. That's why I'm wondering, why the news are not full of videos about what is happing in the hospitals and why they are not trying to show what it is really like to have serious symptomps because of the infection.

Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#25

Post by JoeAltmaier »

mmmmmyumyum wrote: post #11

How do you know that this was the cause of death when all we know is that these people were tested positive on Covid19 before they died? Not denying that Covid19 is a thing and measures are necessary but I think this question is valid when reading such headlines.

It has a dramatic and unmistakable final phase? Plus, Occam's Razor

Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#26

Post by nosianu »

morelisp wrote: post #20
nosianu wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have come to the conclusion that thinking about convincing everybody of everything just does not work. Like, at all. With "everything" I mean all those many, many big and small things, from "facts" to flat earth to this virus to climate etc. etc., and endless list. First, it just does not matter at all what most people think. The scientific way would be to develop a good model to see whose opinions actually matter,…

After careful and measured consideration, HN comes out swinging for technocracy. I'm shocked. (Meanwhile, half the COVID-19 threads are people pissed off because the US did take a technocratic approach to mask recommendations and they hate it because programmers don't get to be part of the inner circle of public health decision makers.)

I am baffled by your response. Where am I asking for technocracy? That's a wild and strange interpretation of what I didn't say at all.

Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#27

Post by FriendlyNormie »

artemonster wrote: post #3

I don't understand how to deal with deniers anymore. I've tried sharing a lot of explanations/articles/videos to the "tis just a flu, bro" crowd from my friends and this convinced nobody. I guess showing even this fact/statistic would do nothing too. Is there a cure or a method to convert such dense crowd? (well, besides bashing their heads with something heavy)

No post body was provided.

Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#28

Post by sobellian »

laszlokorte wrote: post #19
artemonster wrote: post #3

I don't understand how to deal with deniers anymore. I've tried sharing a lot of explanations/articles/videos to the "tis just a flu, bro" crowd from my friends and this convinced nobody. I guess showing even this fact/statistic would do nothing too. Is there a cure or a method to convert such dense crowd? (well, besides bashing their heads with something heavy)

I have no opinion on this but I have read multiple times now that currently if someone dies, say on Heart Disease, and has positively tested on Covid-19, that the death cause is counted as Covid-19. So depending on how many people are really already infected it would be currently kind of impossible to die of anything but Covid-19. Maybe that's all wrong but at least that's how the deniers argue I guess. Can someone r…

There are also a lot of Covid-19 deaths that haven't yet been counted in NYC because they happen at home away from a hospital. So the uncertainty isn't just skewed downward.

Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#29

Post by Murkin »

Since the other causes of death remain static in this chart, its hard to tell if Covid-19 are new cases or "take away from other causes" (and by what percentage).

Would be interesting to see daily chart of Covid-19 deaths as % of total deaths and daily total deaths.

PS. Extra points - number of deaths due to lockdowns (suicides, unaccessible healthcare, etc)

Re: The leading cause of death in the US on Apr 6 was Covid-19

#30

Post by yetihehe »

cfontes wrote: post #12
artemonster wrote: post #3

I don't understand how to deal with deniers anymore. I've tried sharing a lot of explanations/articles/videos to the "tis just a flu, bro" crowd from my friends and this convinced nobody. I guess showing even this fact/statistic would do nothing too. Is there a cure or a method to convert such dense crowd? (well, besides bashing their heads with something heavy)

My solution was to give up. I was stressing too much over it and it drives me insane people are so stubborn without any data to back their claims. If provided data they just wave it aside with a random argument and move immediately on to another topic within the subject criticizing something else, so you have to keep extremely sharp in all topics or they just swing from side to side until they find a topic you have n…

There are two sayings which sum up this situation rather well.

> Arguing with stupid is like wrestling with pig in mud. After some time you see that pig seems to like it.

> Arguing with stupid is like playing chess with a pigeon. It will topple figures, shit in board and be proud of winning.

The problem is when their stupidity affects your life.

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