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Apple Faceshield

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Re: Apple Faceshield

#521

Post by pojntfx »

ogre_codes wrote: post #311
blhack wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it turns out you actually can 3D print some of these in mass quantities. Some of the printers we are working with right now are producing on the order of 10s of thousands of parts per day. And now, there are tool shops in the US right now cutting injection molds to make those parts in the hundreds of thousands of parts per day.

The kind of 3d printing Prusa does (and provided plans for) is a tabletop/ amateur printer, not something which can scale.

They literally print their printers on their printers.

So no, they do mass-produce with them: https://youtu.be/BjoQw5fGk6Q

Re: Apple Faceshield

#522

Post by samcheng »

ksk wrote: post #505
dlubarov wrote: post #470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If those projectiles are aerosolized and are in the air that you breathe It seems like you're imagining that the mucus and saliva particles would behave like a gas, but it's a suspension of liquid particles in the air, which behaves slightly differently. Think of breathing onto glass -- a lot of the aerosol I expel adheres to the glass. Some smaller droplets may move around it, but it's still preferable to receive…

>but it's still preferable to receive a smaller dose of the virus. Could you explain why you believe that? I haven't found anything definitive on this topic.

There is a good New Yorker article on the matter this week:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/04/06/how-does-the-c...

Re: Apple Faceshield

#523

Post by bosswipe »

simonh wrote: post #485
Polylactic_acid wrote: post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I expected this to be for apple factory workers, surprised to see its being sold to other companies.

These are only used by doctors and nurses when treating patients with open airways at very close range to protect from direct splatters with body fluids. Eg when intubating a patient that’s having explosive coughing fits. They are also part of a complete protective system including a mask, elasticated hair cover, full body wrap aprons and long arm gloves. There is no point using a shield without the rest if the gear…

If it's only for that narrow use case then a million per week seems excessive and unnecessary.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#525

Post by bosswipe »

I don't understand why Apple telling Chinese factories to build PPE is helpful. There's massive worldwide demand for this stuff, the factories don't need apple's help to figure that out.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#526

Post by dguest »

leipert wrote: post #195

The Czech 3D Printer company Prusa has been on it for a while: https://www.prusa3d.com/covid19/ and they have been open-sourcing the design. You can print it on a 3D printer. Based on that design (and others) makers in Germany have started organizing, so that people can either request shields or supply shields. Organized on Slack and into local distribution hubs. We hace started sharing supplies and even got discount…

I'd imagine the flexibility you get from 3d printing could have a double edge: on one hand anyone can fork the design, which gives enormous potential for iterative development; on the other hand forks lead to a lack of interchangeable parts.

Are people iterating on the design much?

Re: Apple Faceshield

#527

Post by ehsankia »

gowld wrote: post #6

Context: https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/5/21209270/apple-face-shield... “Our first shipment was delivered to Kaiser hospital facilities in the Santa Clara Valley this past week, and the feedback from doctors was very positive,” Cook says. “These pack flat, one hundred per box. Each shield is assembled in less than two minutes and is fully adjustable. We’re sourcing materials and manufacturing in the US and China.” A…

I'm curious, I've been seeing a lot of calls for 3D printing similar looking Face shields, which are very different from face masks. What is the use for this? Are they actually useful to health care professionals? Face mask + goggles fully covers the 3 places the virus can enter (mouth, nose and eyes), but these shields seem like they would be more useful for people who have the virus than those who don't.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#528

Post by brodie »

roenxi wrote: post #382
mbreese wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it seems pretty likely that I will be protected And you'd be wrong. Sure, a face shield will protect you from liquid streaming out at you (partially). However, it isn't a liquid that you need to protect yourself from in this instance... it is aerosolized particles. And those travel in the air. So when you breathe in, that air can and will move around the face shield. The sibling comment about smoke moving is exactl…

You say that with great confidence and a lack of sources; and I'm guessing we are equally ignorant on the actual physics of how small droplets move. The details aren't clear on how the virus is spreading. The virus might have multiple modes of transmission. Closing 2 of them reliably a great deal. There are important things to do with "catching COVID" that aren't binary; starting doses likely matter as well. I'd rath…

It’s okay to admit you’re wrong. It’s okay to not understand everything. It’s okay to defer to experts.

So many people on HN and in tech have the same attitude that if they just spend 5 minutes thinking about something then they can intuit an answer and that they must be right. This is a dangerous way of thinking. If anyone took what you’ve been saying as correct they’d be endangering themselves and depriving medical professionals of tools they need.

Re: Apple Faceshield

#529

Post by zimpenfish »

ehsankia wrote: post #527
gowld wrote: post #6

Context: https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/5/21209270/apple-face-shield... “Our first shipment was delivered to Kaiser hospital facilities in the Santa Clara Valley this past week, and the feedback from doctors was very positive,” Cook says. “These pack flat, one hundred per box. Each shield is assembled in less than two minutes and is fully adjustable. We’re sourcing materials and manufacturing in the US and China.” A…

I'm curious, I've been seeing a lot of calls for 3D printing similar looking Face shields , which are very different from face masks. What is the use for this? Are they actually useful to health care professionals? Face mask + goggles fully covers the 3 places the virus can enter (mouth, nose and eyes), but these shields seem like they would be more useful for people who have the virus than those who don't.

> Face mask + goggles fully covers the 3 places the virus can enter (mouth, nose and eyes)

I believe face masks are only 95% effective at best and that's only with a proper N95 which a lot of medical staff appear not to be able to get hold of. Hence they're wearing things like Buffs or cycling masks to make do. In that situation, having another layer that can stop droplets etc. from reaching the mask in the first place makes sense to me.

Plus it stops a whole lot of messy body fluids from reaching the mask and goggles which cuts out a swap/clean cycle (again, difficult if there's no spares!)

[Edit to correct 'googles' to 'goggles', FFHS]

Re: Apple Faceshield

#530

Post by disillusioned »

ehsankia wrote: post #527
gowld wrote: post #6

Context: https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/5/21209270/apple-face-shield... “Our first shipment was delivered to Kaiser hospital facilities in the Santa Clara Valley this past week, and the feedback from doctors was very positive,” Cook says. “These pack flat, one hundred per box. Each shield is assembled in less than two minutes and is fully adjustable. We’re sourcing materials and manufacturing in the US and China.” A…

I'm curious, I've been seeing a lot of calls for 3D printing similar looking Face shields , which are very different from face masks. What is the use for this? Are they actually useful to health care professionals? Face mask + goggles fully covers the 3 places the virus can enter (mouth, nose and eyes), but these shields seem like they would be more useful for people who have the virus than those who don't.

Face shields provide specific protection against bodily fluids: sneezes, blood sprays, etc., that would further soil the masks you wear underneath them.

This study talks through the advantages of adding them to the repertoire for infectious disease control as part of your PPE: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5015006/

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