Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is the point of 3d printing something that clearly needs to be mass-produced in great quantities? Maybe it "feels good", but it's just too slow. I'm honestly not sure why people don't just use plastic food wrap as a cheap improvised alternative for face shields. It's lightweight, readily available, disposable, fits over any attire and does not restrict visibility.
Because it turns out you actually can 3D print some of these in mass quantities. Some of the printers we are working with right now are producing on the order of 10s of thousands of parts per day. And now, there are tool shops in the US right now cutting injection molds to make those parts in the hundreds of thousands of parts per day.
Apple Faceshield
311–320 of 663 posts
Re: Apple Faceshield
#312Earlier quoted context omitted.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2190272/ Table 6. Wearing an N95 mask reduces your chance of contracting SARS by 91%. I apologize if my frustration comes through here, but the data is very clear and people are dying in the thousands because they're not protecting themselves.
It feels as though arguments will be received with claims of "mental gymnastics", so I will just point out the differences in use and function between a face shield and an N95 mask. You're free to try and purchase a face shield if you'd like. Best of luck.
There's no luck involved, I purchased a face shield almost two months ago, although I usually just wear mask+goggles, gloves if necessary when I need to go out. The face shield is for if one of our family members gets sick and we need to care for each other. Then it will be mask+goggles+gloves+gown+face shield.
Re: Apple Faceshield
#313Earlier quoted context omitted.
And before anyone gets big ideas about the chloroform, it is not pure chloroform; it is generally contaminated by phosgene, which is truly terrible stuff.
During a wasted youth I poured over hundreds of The Hardy Boys Casefiles, where they'd receive and recover from a traumatic brain injury 3-5 nights a week (getting "knocked out"). Thanks to your comment I now know the other nights, where they were not rendered unconscious by blunt trauma, but rather through a rag of chloroform, they were probably inhaling phosgene too. Those boys were sure putting their futures at ri…
Re: Apple Faceshield
#314Earlier quoted context omitted.
1. Having 100 visors is ideal, but I'll still take 1 visor over none. 2. It's really hard to breathe through food wrap and it doesn't cling to hair well.
>It's really hard to breathe through food wrap and it doesn't cling to hair well. You wrap it around the top of your head (forehead level), so it sticks to itself. You keeps the bottom part loose, so it doesn't restrict breathing. It works.
Re: Apple Faceshield
#315Earlier quoted context omitted.
I wish media would stop tooting how amazing "3D Printing" is. It is just one of the ways of manufacturing. IMO, it is a poor way to do anything besides home hobby projects (there are a few medical exceptions). It takes 12+ hours to print anything useful. Yet media loves talking about 3D printing. For anyone who has worked in product design and manufacturing, it is one thing to be able to make a few prototypes (which…
> It takes 12+ hours to print anything useful. Yet media loves talking about 3D printing. Face shields are useful and can be printed in under 3 hours (for the Prusa design). Some people have knocked the time down to about one hour. For something that costs cents and can be made at home, that's pretty useful. > it is a poor way to do anything besides home hobby projects Tell that to SpaceX. "3D Printing" encompasses a…
> Face shields are useful and can be printed in under 3 hours (for the Prusa design). Some people have knocked the time down to about one hour. For something that costs cents and can be made at home, that's pretty useful.
3 hours is still too long and that's not the central point I am arguing about. It is mostly about media coverage. If you have a 3D printer, by all means use it.
> Tell that to SpaceX.
I've worked on 3D printers before it was cool. Way back in 2005, I designed and built turbine blade prototypes on Stratasys 3D printers that cost upwards of $250k. Can we get past this narrative of 3D printing usefulness to its narrow application? It is not going to revolutionize manufacturing anytime soon. Tell that to GE, Lockheed Martin, Apple, Intel, Boeing, etc. Every company has invested in 3D printing primarily for prototyping and occasionally for medium-volume production. You're not going to see 3D printed Nike soles on $40 shoe anytime soon.
If you look at the amount of manufacturing that takes place on 3D printers vs. other technologies, you would not even see the slice of the pie that is for "3D printing".
Additive manufacturing has niche applications.
> All these technologies have been around for decades now. Why would they get any attention?
Because in the time of war, when the nation is mobilizing to making millions of something, you want the press to talk about things that work?
> Take injection molding. It may take 20 seconds, but that's _ after the manufacturing facilities and the mold are setup _ . This is unlike essentially pressing a print button, which is where we want to go.
No shit, you need mold that takes time to make and validate. Usually 3-4 weeks, sometimes 8 weeks. But when there is a national emergency, you can turn it around within 48 hours. That's including the entire NRE process, design, validation and tooling. After 48 hours, you would have printed a few dozen parts in your beloved 3D printers. I would be churning out a part every 20 seconds after the initial 48 hours. Even if it is 100+ hours, it is still worth it when the quantity you want to make is 5 million.
> 5 million units a week... these are not prototypes. Call them production samples or what have you, but this is an assembly line.
Hey! why would you point that out? Isn't that obvious that by definition you cannot make 5 million prototypes? "These prototypes" - I was referring to the aforementioned reference to the prototypes in the previous sentence. Jeez.
Re: Apple Faceshield
#316Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was hoping everyone in the US might be able to buy one. Ideally, they'd be cheap enough for municipalities to buy and distribute.
> I was hoping everyone in the US might be able to buy one. This burst of PPE being produced in mass quantities are and were never meant to go in the hands of the general public (i.e., non healthcare workers), though. The general public does not need to be walking around with a full face shield, that’ll be a waste of materials, time and money, unfortunately.
Re: Apple Faceshield
#317Earlier quoted context omitted.
Stanford hospital, for example, throws away one N95 per patient doctor visit. They are not sterilizing and reusing. So my friend who works there is using many dozens of them per day. It seems like they could come up with material-preserving procedures like sterilization, but they're not.
Because best data to date is that sterilization procedures damage the mask in ways that render it unsafe. When someone comes up with data finding a safe way to do so, the masks won’t go in the trash. In the meantime, I’d you have the masks to spare, you -should- be using them safely. Masks are pointless if you use them in a way that will get you sick.
Re: Apple Faceshield
#318Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think the actual racks are plastic. Specifically, all the recommendations I have seen are that you should not microweave or put in the dishwasher plastic containers. That's for food, so you can see where the leaching concerns would be. But I wonder for this if part of it is that it has such close proximity to a lot of your face.
No, but the walls are.
Re: Apple Faceshield
#319Earlier quoted context omitted.
Like I posted below, you can make an improvised "face shield" out of plastic food wrap in about 15 seconds. No parts needed. Wrap it around your head at forehead level so it sticks to itself. Keep the bottom part loose, so you can freely breathe. Readily available, cheap, disposable, lightweight, does not restrict visibility. If you're working in the wind, you might need to weigh down the bottom part with something,…
You're saying to literally wrap your face in plastic wrap and leave a little hole to breathe? I think someone's going to try this advice and suffocate.
Are you trolling or serious? I said forehead, not face. Obviously, do not wrap plastic foil around your face.
Re: Apple Faceshield
#320Context: https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/5/21209270/apple-face-shield... “Our first shipment was delivered to Kaiser hospital facilities in the Santa Clara Valley this past week, and the feedback from doctors was very positive,” Cook says. “These pack flat, one hundred per box. Each shield is assembled in less than two minutes and is fully adjustable. We’re sourcing materials and manufacturing in the US and China.” A…
I was hoping everyone in the US might be able to buy one. Ideally, they'd be cheap enough for municipalities to buy and distribute.