Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 136 posts

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#61

Post by lotsofpulp »

theandrewbailey wrote: post #47
brenden2 wrote: post #29

What I learned in school growing up was that if I lose a bunch of money gambling at the casino with my credit card, I don't get a free bailout from the government. But maybe things have changed?

It might be a variation on: If you owe the bank a million dollars, the bank owns you, but if you owe the bank a billion dollars, you own the bank.

step 1: get sufficient voters invested in equities via index funds and ETFs, meaning pension fund investments, 401k, personal investments, etc.

Step 2: bail out market each time as it’s politically untenable to let the broader market prices decline

Socialism, but the higher % of total equity you own, the better the socialism works for you. Bonus if you have connections to people who can help you finance purchases, especially when the market is down.

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#62

Post by thrav »

theandrewbailey wrote: post #47
brenden2 wrote: post #29

What I learned in school growing up was that if I lose a bunch of money gambling at the casino with my credit card, I don't get a free bailout from the government. But maybe things have changed?

It might be a variation on: If you owe the bank a million dollars, the bank owns you, but if you owe the bank a billion dollars, you own the bank.

+use jobs as leverage

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#63

Post by cmrdporcupine »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #61
theandrewbailey wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might be a variation on: If you owe the bank a million dollars, the bank owns you, but if you owe the bank a billion dollars, you own the bank.

step 1: get sufficient voters invested in equities via index funds and ETFs, meaning pension fund investments, 401k, personal investments, etc. Step 2: bail out market each time as it’s politically untenable to let the broader market prices decline Socialism, but the higher % of total equity you own, the better the socialism works for you. Bonus if you have connections to people who can help you finance purchases, es…

It's only "socialism" in the bizarre American definition where "socialism" = "anything government."

Socialism is social ownership of the economy, what you're describing the opposite. There's another word for what you're describing, which is the extreme capture of the state by corporate entities: corporatism. The extreme form of which is fascism.

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#65

Post by kitotik »

HashThis wrote: post #32
brenden2 wrote: post #29

What I learned in school growing up was that if I lose a bunch of money gambling at the casino with my credit card, I don't get a free bailout from the government. But maybe things have changed?

The privileged class knows that congress sells us out. The privileged class are just again working to rob the masses to wealth transfer more to the privileged classes. Happens every year, some more visible than others. Hopefully this is one time congress won't sell us out.

> Hopefully this is one time

> congress won't sell us out.

Uh, didn’t it already happen, again?

Propping up aerospace and banks again with taxpayer money, sending only a fraction (call it a “token”) to SMBs, with near unchecked disbursement powers, seems like they’ve continued on their same general strategy of wealth consolidation.

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#66

Post by danharaj »

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #53
brenden2 wrote: post #29

What I learned in school growing up was that if I lose a bunch of money gambling at the casino with my credit card, I don't get a free bailout from the government. But maybe things have changed?

Marx said it 174 years ago... "The executive of the modern state is nothing but a committee for managing the common affairs of the whole bourgeoisie" The state is created by the class of people who own capital, in order to mediate, protect, justify and manage a world in which they continue to own and profit from their ownership of capital.

I don't even know how this is controversial, and yet here we are. You said the Mx word, I guess.

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#67

Post by omgwtfbyobbq »

Retric wrote: post #56
cs702 wrote: post #46

Buffett on private equity:[a] > For some years, these purchasers accurately called themselves “leveraged buyout firms.” When that term got a bad name in the early 1990s – remember RJR and Barbarians at the Gate? – these buyers hastily relabeled themselves “private-equity.” The name may have changed but that was all: Equity is dramatically reduced and debt is piled on in virtually all private-equity purchases. Indeed,…

> majority of leveraged firms into bankruptcy. I am unsure how this is different from the normal failure of leveraged firms. When so many are failing within 3 years in normal times, this just seems to be more of the same.

I don't think it is different. At the same time, I wouldn't think most firms accrue as much debt normally as PE firms do when they buy them out.

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#68

Post by Havoc »

TomMckenny wrote: post #40
Havoc wrote: post #4

>But do they really deserve any part in a bailout? Do any of these companies? The whole concept of bailouts create bad incentives - to me that's more the crux of the issue. But if you're gonna do them anyway then I see little justification for including/excl some just because they're listed vs private. Plus it makes way more sense to "save" the economy at grass roots level anyway. I'd prefer more of a suddenly expand…

These two options for saving the economy: corporate bailout vs social safety net essentially correspond with belief in trickle down vs Keynesian stimulus. Stated even more bluntly, it is essentially whether you believe customers or assets are most important for business. It is why the current path begins to resemble 1929 where consumer buying power spiraled downward. If the social isolation period ends with millions…

>Stated even more bluntly, it is essentially whether you believe customers or assets are most important for business.

No I think the last four words of this quote are the problem.

This needs to be more about humans and less about corporate entities. And I'm not talking socialism here. We just need to move away from economy = listed companies and more towards economy is the aggregate of people's actions.

>These two options for saving the economy: corporate bailout vs social safety net essentially correspond with belief in trickle down vs Keynesian stimulus.

What?

Social safety net: Here is a place to sleep tonight Mr Homeless

Keynesian stim:

>Keynesian fiscal stimulus is a decision by the government to increase government spending financed by government borrowing

Quite a far stretch equating those.

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#69

Post by lowdose »

close04 wrote: post #31
brenden2 wrote: post #29

What I learned in school growing up was that if I lose a bunch of money gambling at the casino with my credit card, I don't get a free bailout from the government. But maybe things have changed?

Companies get a bailout based on how big the fallout is if they fail (lost jobs, lost value for the economy, etc.) or how much value is expected they'll bring if they're saved. Like investing in Tesla even when they constantly lost money because you expect it to recover and bring you a profit. I am not considering any other interests involved, lobbying, bribes, etc. While important I'm sure the first part is already…

No all these companies in need of a bailout are suits without skin in the game. Elon took a big risk with his own money which means you as shareholder of Tesla are shielded from the classic agency problem.

Suits empty the company in good times and when shit hits the fan they put their hands in the air and say "well I did my best".

Re: Private Equity Wants in on the Bailout? Spare Me

#70

Post by raminf »

brenden2 wrote: post #29

What I learned in school growing up was that if I lose a bunch of money gambling at the casino with my credit card, I don't get a free bailout from the government. But maybe things have changed?

You do get to write-off your gambling losses, though.

Not sure why, but there it is: https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tips/jobs-and-career/can-you...

Post reply on HN